Asking for testimony about Neidan

[Rio]

I have been looking online about people that have followed a Neidan path and that talked about it but I have some trouble finding information about actually practical use.

So I will ask here if any of you has followed this path. And If yes, what have been the change in your mind, body, spirituality and overall your life ?

I am hesitant about going deep with it as it requires a lot of time, energy and dedication.

My purpose with this practice would be to be even more in accordance with the Tao.

But I suspect that there is potentialy more so I'm curious about what it could bring else.

[Shadow_self]

9 minutes ago, Rio said:

I am hesitant about going deep with it as it requires a lot of time, energy and dedication.

 

Id suggest parking the idea of Neidan for now to be honest

 

Its not something you can immediately pick up and do. It requires years of foundation training to make it work (otherwise you'll just get experiences at best)

 

Take up some qigong, neigong or seated practice like anapanasati. See it the practice resonates with you

 

If it does, your hesitation will soon disappear, if it doesnt, then you've saved yourself some time

 

I would not base such decisions on other peoples experiences. What happens for them may not be in the cards for you

 

Best to go at this from a position of curious exploration  

[Rio]

45 minutes ago, Shadow_self said:

 

Id suggest parking the idea of Neidan for now to be honest

 

Its not something you can immediately pick up and do. It requires years of foundation training to make it work (otherwise you'll just get experiences at best)

 

Take up some qigong, neigong or seated practice like anapanasati. See it the practice resonates with you

 

If it does, your hesitation will soon disappear, if it doesnt, then you've saved yourself some time

 

I would not base such decisions on other peoples experiences. What happens for them may not be in the cards for you

 

Best to go at this from a position of curious exploration  

 

Thank you for your consideration and answer. But I think maybe you answered like this because I haven't given a lot of my background so here it is :

 

I have been meditating since 5 years, anapanasati, Maha sattipathana, Vipassana (Goenka style), a bit of zen (which I'm doing more recently).

I practice 1 or 2 hours a day.

I have perfect physical form, not from Tai chi, but from a sport involving a lot of movement (floreio), of control, of breathing right, and flow.

I'm greatly aligned with who I am in almost total acceptance of myself, and I'm looking to move forward that point in spirituality.

At the moment, I'm working on my ego more precisely as I would like to physically experience the fact that "I" do not exist and that we all are one. Going more deeply into the Dao in a way.

 

Regarding the ego, I'm suprise because for me Neidan is a way of doing just that, realizing the no "I". And the non dualistic way of thing.

But I read a lot of answer that resonate with more or less ego in the answer from people supposed to practice it. I wonder if it is then the right place/way of going where I want to go.

 

I come from Buddhism (mostly theravada) which was incredible and which is still a big foundation for me. I recently discovered Tao and after reading the 3 big books, I'm learning about energy work which talk to me, but from which I would like to know more.

 

Now that you know that, if your answer is different I would like to know about it

 

As for not to base my decision on experience of other, it's more about deciding if I want to be dedicating the time for Neidan (as it would take from my meditating/sport time). And I want to know what can come from this dedication. (Because results take so much time)

After I made my mind, I will try for myself (I'm already actually), and see if the insight people gave me resonate with me !

[Taoist Texts]

1 hour ago, Rio said:

people that have followed a Neidan path and that talked about it but I have some trouble finding information about actually practical use.

there is no practical use. the western neidan is a fantasy industry like Comicon, dud ranches, self help speakes, at best it is infotainment plus some larping. Ask a neidaneer what is it that he can do that a regular joe cannot? Neidan, what is it good for? Absolutely nothing.

[Shadow_self]

22 minutes ago, Rio said:

Now that you know that, if your answer is different I would like to know about it

 

My answer wont vary greatly to be honest, thought the fact that you are already practicing a form of seated meditative work would be very useful, and that you do a martial art will greatly help with the mind/body connection. So you already have some things working in your favour  

 

At this point, id  suggest moving into a practice of neigong. This would allow you to start building a foundation for neidan

 

In my opinion, Damo Mitchells  material would be the best publicly available option to get going.

 

But before you invest money in a course, I suggest you pick up a copy of this book here

 

https://www.google.ie/books/edition/A_Comprehensive_Guide_to_Daoist_Nei_Gong/4mpnDwAAQBAJ?hl=en&gbpv=1&dq=neigong+damo+mitchell&printsec=frontcover

 

This will give you an idea if its for you or not. If so, you could then explore his online or in person teaching. Its a very comprehensive overview of what you are looking to dive into

 

There are others also, but thats my personal recommendation

 

Hope that helps, and best of luck  

[Forestgreen]

46 minutes ago, Taoist Texts said:

dud ranches, 

But with robes, not hats. 

Or, is there a funny hat with the robe?

[Taoist Texts]

24 minutes ago, Forestgreen said:

Or, is there a funny hat with the robe?

more of a cap ... but its a must.

https://www.redbubble.com/i/hat/Spiritual-Asian-Neidan-Tee-by-SRanabhat/107278536.2WLDQ

 

[liminal_luke]

Luke had a hard time at the dud ranch but had nobody to blame but himself.  Sick horses, lumpy beds, cold food.  He should of read the brochure more carefully.

Edited September 8 by liminal_luke

[Forestgreen]

@Taoist Texts there os a matchning tee-shirt. 🥰

[Cobie]

1 hour ago, Taoist Texts said:

more of a cap ... but its a must. ..

Shouldn’t that be, ‘Introverted but Willing to Discuss the Neidan. 
 

 

[Forestgreen]

"Introverted but willing to discuss but not disclose neidan"

[Taoist Texts]

48 minutes ago, Cobie said:

Shouldn’t that be, ‘Introverted but Willing to Discuss the Neidan. 

heck if i know

https://www.mit.edu/course/21/21.guide/art-pnou.htm

52 minutes ago, Forestgreen said:

@Taoist Texts there os a matchning tee-shirt. 🥰

finally some practical use for ND

48 minutes ago, Forestgreen said:

 disclose neidan"

i tried that couple of times. people just roll eyes shake heads walk away

[Cobie]

 

15 hours ago, Taoist Texts said:

heck if i know

 

Righto. I don’t know really but from your old posts I had understood  possibly misunderstood  the following  : 

- it’s ‘the neidan’, as it’s a ‘thing’ (it also goes under the name of ‘the embryo’, or ‘the elixir’).

- the ignorant Western neidanists con artists think it’s ‘neidan’ (no ‘the’), thinking it’s a process one can practice. 

 

 

Edited September 9 by Cobie

[Cobie]

 

1 hour ago, Taoist Texts said:

… people just roll eyes shake heads walk away

 That’s exactly the response I get to my DDJ translations.  

 

 

[Taoist Texts]

9 hours ago, Cobie said:

Righto. I don’t know really but from your old posts I had understood  possibly misunderstood  the following  : 

- it’s ‘the neidan’, as it’s a ‘thing’ (it also goes under the name of ‘the embryo’, or ‘the elixir’).

- the ignorant Western neidanists con artists think it’s ‘neidan’ (no ‘the’), thinking it’s a process one can practice. 

 

very good. thats exactly what i meant

[Forestgreen]

14 hours ago, Cobie said:

 

- the ignorant Western neidanists con artists think it’s ‘neidan’ (no ‘the’), thinking it’s a process one can practice. 

Or, doesn't care enough of the chinese terminology to write neidanshu or any similar linguistic possibility. 

 

Hopefully, everyone in the area understand the difference between having a result and trying to produce that result.

Edited September 9 by Forestgreen
Added stuff.

[Apech]

Football is the round thing you kick and not the game! Fools.

[Taoist Texts]

8 minutes ago, Apech said:

Football is the round thing you kick and not the game! 

yes and neither of those is the

17 minutes ago, Forestgreen said:

Hopefully, everyone in the area understand

one would think so, but alas...

Quote

 

You students heard the truth of my Dao, so take heart urgently, every moment be alert, maintain this heart, guard this nature, go deeper and deeper, study ardently, in order to get closer to Heavenly spontaneity, and after that not to regret to be born as a human, so follow this and you can reach Heaven, you can count on becoming a great man who accomplished Dao.

If not so, if even one thought is not restrained – it will cause a fall, unwittingly into the 6 ways and 3 paths of rebirths, and if you want to exit the tumultuous waves of the bitter sea, it will be hard.

I teach you students:

– if you seek for your material body to be longevous and firm – it is nothing else but protecting semen and multiplying qi, making the foundation strong, obtaining the Heavenly allotted years;

- and if you seek for your dharma body to be eternal – it is also nothing else but melting spirit and returning to emptiness, melting emptiness and joining with Dao, thus getting the proof result of the spiritual sainthood; then both goals will be accomplished.

If you are not yet capable of Dao, you must make your body strong in order to practice the bright Dao{ (neo) Confucianism}.

Once you are done with Confucianism, then you must melt your dharma body in order to undertake Dao.

            For the recent time, I have not require you to melt emptiness to join with Dao, but have required protecting semen and multiplying qi, accumulating them for a long time, which will make dharma body self-completed as well.

            I teach each beginner to conduct this accumulation, so do not think that this work and Dao are separate. When your accumulation is large – then it will become the secret merit, which will make your Heavenly gift secure, will bring forth your original face of humaneness, without leaving even one iota of worldly dust in you, your many evil thoughts and evil will dissipate clean, and the one primal pure qi will be always present in you.

            If not so, if the impurities are not rid, even if you complete sainthood, it will be a spoiled sainthood, when visiting not able reach the Great Net of Heavenly castle, when rising not able to travel to the central palace.

Huang Yuan-ji

 

 

 

[Shadow_self]

25 minutes ago, Forestgreen said:

Hopefully, everyone in the area understand the difference between having a result and trying to produce that result.

 

Or, fooling onself into thinking they have the result in the first place

 

Genreally speaking, one can fool themselves or others with the mind, But one cannot do that when the transformation that occurs further back ripples down to the physical level  

[Cobie]

 

1 hour ago, Taoist Texts said:

quoted, “… melting spirit and returning to emptiness, melting emptiness and joining with Dao … “ 

If only I knew what that meant. 
 

 

Edited September 9 by Cobie

[Forestgreen]

So, protecting the semen and multipying qi is enough to complete the dharma body?

[Shadow_self]

1 hour ago, Forestgreen said:

So, protecting the semen and multipying qi is enough to complete the dharma body?

 

Well, according to how certain folk tend to translate things, apparently...

 

I propose an experiment

 

Place semen in a sealed container.

 

According to how sperm banks state, one needs to store it at  minus 196 degrees C to preserve (protect) it.

 

Every so often, breathe (beacause breath is qi , right)  into the container  to  "multiply" qi

 

Repeat until dharma body is complete...

[Taoist Texts]

4 hours ago, Forestgreen said:

So, protecting the semen and multipying qi is enough to complete the dharma body?

yes. (terms and conditions apply)

5 hours ago, Cobie said:

If only I knew what that meant. 

it just means a pure calm mind

[Forestgreen]

3 hours ago, Taoist Texts said:

yes. (terms and conditions apply)

 

The usual ones" Buyer beware? 

[Taoist Texts]

3 hours ago, Forestgreen said:

The usual ones" Buyer beware? 

that too, but for starters we gotta know what do all these words even mean 'protecting the semen , multipying qi , to complete the dharma body'.