ABRAMELIN ORDEAL

[Daniel]

14 hours ago, Sir Darius the Clairvoyent said:

But the answer is no haha

 

The screen name is a joke.  Good to know.

[Daniel]

14 hours ago, Sir Darius the Clairvoyent said:

About as much as these guys: https://youtu.be/UDxRad4yZjM?si=Bhfc1rnYWSNYsK7p

 

 I grant very little credibility to what I watch on YouTube by default.

[Daniel]

13 hours ago, Nungali said:

However I was able to cite proof

 

You proved that you enjoy making ritual objects.  They are inspiring to you.  

 

The english translations of occult content embellish and exaggerate.  They are a mix of fact and fiction intended to trigger the reader's imagination.

 

 

Edited October 22 by Daniel

[Daniel]

On 10/20/2024 at 3:47 PM, Nungali said:

having placed the lighted Charcoal in the Censer, light the Lamp also. You shall then robe yourself, taking first the White Vestment, and over this you shall put on that 3 of Silk and Gold, then the Girdle, and upon your head you shall place the Crown, and you shall lay the Wand upon the Altar. Then, having put the Perfume in the Censer you shall fall upon your knees ...  "

 

^  There are some classical 'magical weapons / tools ' .  Any real ritual magician recognises these instantly  and knows their significance and attribution .

 

 

They became "magical" after the composition of the Abramelin.  Outsiders added the "magical" label to concepts which were foreign and misunderstood.

 

For example, the girdle is a "gartel".  It's just a simple black belt.  They're worn when praying.  The "wand" is a "yad".  It's a simple pointer used when reading from a traditional Torah scroll in Hebrew.  They can be ornate, but, they don't need to be anything other than pointy.

 

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gartel

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Yad

 

Edited October 22 by Daniel

[Nungali]

10 hours ago, Daniel said:

 

You proved that you enjoy making ritual objects.  They are inspiring to you.  

 

You are trying to change things to 'make yourself right ' again . I proved by direct quotation they are used in that ritual .

 

 

Your above comment is another red herring .

 

The english translations of occult content embellish and exaggerate.  They are a mix of fact and fiction intended to trigger the reader's imagination.

 

another red herring on this issue

 

 

 

[Nungali]

On 10/22/2024 at 8:00 AM, Cobie said:

 

 

 

great answer (sarcasm)
 

 

 

 

 

'shit for brains ' ?

 

That would be an insult  ,  would it not ?

 

[Sir Darius the Clairvoyent]

@Nungali I would never tell you what to do, but dont you think it is time to… well, let put it this way: no amount of reason, Logic or arguments is going to Get trough.

[Cobie]

6 minutes ago, Nungali said:

… shit ..

Think of it as ‘compost’, dear.

 

 

[Nungali]

16 hours ago, Daniel said:

 

They became "magical" after the composition of the Abramelin.  Outsiders added the "magical" label to concepts which were foreign and misunderstood.

 

For example, the girdle is a "gartel".  It's just a simple black belt.  They're worn when praying.  The "wand" is a "yad".  It's a simple pointer used when reading from a traditional Torah scroll in Hebrew.  They can be ornate, but, they don't need to be anything other than pointy.

 

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gartel

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Yad

 

 

And a menorah  is merely  for holding up candles      

 

Note to others :

 

" The Book of Abramelin tells the story of an Egyptian mage named Abraham, or Abra-Melin, who taught a system of magic to Abraham of Worms, a Jew from Worms, Germany " 

 

The ritual comes from an Egyptian who taught it to a Jew .... it isnt a Jewish ritual .

 

So now Egyptians had no wands ... they where copies of  a yad pointer   

 

 

 

 

 [ " It is possible that wands were used by pre-historic peoples. It is mentioned that 'rods' (as well as rings) were found with Red Lady of Paviland in Britain. ^....

During the Middle Kingdom of Egypt, apotropaic wands began to be used during birth ceremonies. These wands were made out of hippopotamus tusks ^....

The earliest apotropaic wands used in Egypt were undecorated, but "from around 1850 BC, they were usually provided with decorations of apotropaic figures directly related to the sun religion, or particular aspects of it, inscribed on the convex upper side... most of whom carry knives to ward off evil forces".^[3] These apotropaic wands were also inscribed with protective text ...

The concept of magic wands was used by the ancient Greek writer Homer, in his epic poems ...

.  Homer wrote that magic wands were used by three different gods, namely Hermes, Athena, and Circe. In The Iliad, Homer wrote that Hermes generally used his magic wand Caduceus to make people sleep and wake up. In The Odyssey, Homer wrote that Athena used her magic wand to make Odysseus old, and then young again, and that Circe used her magic wand to turn Odysseus's men into pigs. ...

By the 1st century AD, the wand was a common symbol of magic in Roman cults, especially Mithraism .]

 

 

Edited October 23 by Nungali

[Nungali]

6 minutes ago, Sir Darius the Clairvoyent said:

@Nungali I would never tell you what to do, but dont you think it is time to… well, let put it this way: no amount of reason, Logic or arguments is going to Get trough.

 

I know that .

 

My posts are for others who might be interested in the subject and want to know about things without interference from those that nothing of this subject or want to convert it all to their specific 'cultural knowhow ' .

[Nungali]

3 minutes ago, Cobie said:

Think of it as ‘compost’, dear.

 

 

 

Either way , its a huge infraction of site rules - no insulting . I am not really worried though ... as long as you realize  that 'opens the door' for a 'return volley ' .

 

maybe thats the intent , to divert from the subject at hand  ? 

 

You see, certain demonic forces have been attracted to this thread , due to its subject matter and content .

 

Oh dear .... looks like I am going to have top do one of my on-liine exorcisms again !  Hoi- hum .

[Sir Darius the Clairvoyent]

Gotcha brother. Like an australian herding dog, but instead of sheep its for a goat in sinai.

[Cobie]

@Nungali it’s just a funny picture for a dum answer, not really an insult at all imo.

[Nungali]

Just now, Cobie said:

@Nungali it’s just a funny picture for a dum answer, not really an insult at all imo.

 

Hey .... thats close to what I say when I get in trouble for a bad 'joke '  .

[Sir Darius the Clairvoyent]

Haha chill both of you, it didnt give me ptsd

[Nungali]

[Nungali]

[stirling]

To summon "my" HGA I actually just did this:

 

 

This has resulted in a series of vividly life-like ongoing visions. Worked within a week. No props needed.

[forestofclarity]

MODERATOR NOTE: OP was previously banned for, among other things, trying to sell and/or give away courses. Re-banned. I will leave the thread open. 

[Daniel]

On 10/22/2024 at 2:37 PM, Nungali said:

The Book of Abramelin tells the story of an Egyptian mage named Abraham

 

This is from chapter 2, using your chosen translation ( Mathers ) on sacred-texts.com.  

 

which I had to study induced me to go to seek him in order to learn from him. But this man also had not received from the Lord the GIFT, and a perfect grace; because, although he forced himself to manifest unto me certain deep Mysteries of the Holy Qabalah, he by no means arrived at the goal; and in his Magic he did not in any way make use of the Wisdom of the Lord, but instead availed himself of certain arts and superstitions of infidel and idolatrous nations, in part derived from the Egyptians, Together with images of the Medes and of the Persians, with herbs of the Arabians, together with the power of the Stars and Constellations; and, finally, he had drawn from every people and nation, and even from the Christians, some diabolical Art. And in everything the Spirits blinded him to such an extent, even while obeying him in some ridiculous and inconsequent matter, that he actually believed that his blindness and error were the Veritable Magic, and be therefore pushed no further his research into the True and Sacred Magic. I also learned his extravagant experiments, and for ten years did I remain buried in so great an error, until that after the ten years I arrived in Egypt at the house of an Ancient Sage who was called ABRAMELIM, who put me into the true Path as I will declare it unto thee hereafter, and he gave me better instruction and doctrine than all the others; but this particular grace was granted me by the Almighty Father of all Mercy, that is to say, ALMIGHTY GOD, who little by little illuminated mine understanding and opened mine eyes to see and admire, to contemplate, and search out His Divine Wisdom, in such a manner that it became possible unto me to further and further understand and comprehend the Sacred Mystery by which I entered into the knowledge of the Holy Angels

 

https://sacred-texts.com/grim/abr/abr008.htm

 

[Daniel]

On 10/22/2024 at 2:37 PM, Nungali said:

So now Egyptians had no wands ... they where copies of  a yad pointer   

 

What ever it is, this "wand" would not be "idolatrous", nor "superstitious".    See quote above.

 

You seem to assume that any and all "Egyptian" is the same.  Chapter 2 of the book contrasts a diabolical "Egyptian" with Abramelin.

 

What does Abramelin teach?   Does he teach Egyptian ceremonial magic with ritual wands? 

Edited October 29 by Daniel

[Nungali]

52 minutes ago, Daniel said:

 

This is from chapter 2, using your chosen translation ( Mathers ) on sacred-texts.com.  

 

which I had to study induced me to go to seek him in order to learn from him. But this man also had not received from the Lord the GIFT, and a perfect grace; because, although he forced himself to manifest unto me certain deep Mysteries of the Holy Qabalah, he by no means arrived at the goal; and in his Magic he did not in any way make use of the Wisdom of the Lord, but instead availed himself of certain arts and superstitions of infidel and idolatrous nations, in part derived from the Egyptians, Together with images of the Medes and of the Persians, with herbs of the Arabians, together with the power of the Stars and Constellations; and, finally, he had drawn from every people and nation, and even from the Christians, some diabolical Art. And in everything the Spirits blinded him to such an extent, even while obeying him in some ridiculous and inconsequent matter, that he actually believed that his blindness and error were the Veritable Magic, and be therefore pushed no further his research into the True and Sacred Magic. I also learned his extravagant experiments, and for ten years did I remain buried in so great an error, until that after the ten years I arrived in Egypt at the house of an Ancient Sage who was called ABRAMELIM, who put me into the true Path as I will declare it unto thee hereafter, and he gave me better instruction and doctrine than all the others; but this particular grace was granted me by the Almighty Father of all Mercy, that is to say, ALMIGHTY GOD, who little by little illuminated mine understanding and opened mine eyes to see and admire, to contemplate, and search out His Divine Wisdom, in such a manner that it became possible unto me to further and further understand and comprehend the Sacred Mystery by which I entered into the knowledge of the Holy Angels

 

https://sacred-texts.com/grim/abr/abr008.htm

 

 

So ? What about it ? 

 

I will tell you what about it .....

 

why did you censor the first sentence  hmmmmmmmmmmmm ?  

 

 

I learned that at Mayence there was a Rabbi who was a notable Sage, and the report went that he possessed in full the Divine Wisdom. The great desire which I had to study induced me to go to seek him in order to learn from him. But this man also had not received from the Lord the GIFT, and a perfect grace; because, although he forced himself to manifest unto me certain deep Mysteries of the Holy Qabalah, he by no means arrived at the goal; and in his Magic he did not in any way make use of the Wisdom of the Lord, but instead availed himself of certain arts and superstitions of infidel and idolatrous nations, in part derived from the Egyptians, 1 together with images of the Medes and of the Persians, with herbs of the Arabians, together with the power of the Stars and Constellations; and, finally, he had drawn from every people and nation, and even from the Christians, some diabolical Art. And in everything the Spirits blinded him to such an extent, even while obeying him in some ridiculous and inconsequent matter, that he actually believed that his blindness and error were the Veritable Magic, and be therefore pushed no further his research into the True and Sacred Magic. I also learned his extravagant experiments, and for ten years did I remain buried in so great an error,

 

The infamous diabolical and infidel one was a Rabbi    

 

 

 

Then he found the good one , an Egyptian

 

until that after the ten years I arrived in Egypt at the house of an Ancient Sage who was called ABRAMELIM, who put me into the true Path as I will declare it unto thee hereafter, and he gave me better instruction and doctrine than all the others;

Edited October 29 by Nungali

[Nungali]

1 hour ago, Daniel said:

 

What ever it is,

 

Ohhhh ... all of a sudden you have shifted from it being an artificial  pointing finger to protect the Torah  to  a 'whatever it is '    

 

 

Quote

 

 

this "wand" would not be "idolatrous", nor "superstitious".    See quote above.

 

Ummm ... the description of the Abramelin  ritual in the book  come after he met the Egyptian Abramelin  and he instructed him in the ritual, which is the bit quoted before about the magical tools used .....    which you said was a pointer , a trying cord and a mere robe  , ecet you 'forgot ' to explain why a croen is needed .

 

Do Jews need a crown on their head to read Torah .  Go on tell me  which one  is 'the crown '  ;

 

 

Its this one isnt it

 

 

 

 

 

Quote

 

You seem to assume that any and all "Egyptian" is the same.

 

Of course I dont  and I have no idea why you would assume that .  Its probably more of a projection  from yourself other than what I think .

 

 

 

Quote

 

  Chapter 2 of the book contrasts a diabolical "Egyptian" with Abramelin.

 

 

What ! ? 

 

Take a powder Daniel !

 

" I learned that at Mayence there was a Rabbi who was a notable Sage, and the report went that he possessed in full the Divine Wisdom. The great desire which I had to study induced me to go to seek him in order to learn from him. But this man also had not received from the Lord the GIFT, and a perfect grace; because, although he forced himself to manifest unto me certain deep Mysteries of the Holy Qabalah, he by no means arrived at the goal; and in his Magic he did not in any way make use of the Wisdom of the Lord, but instead availed himself of certain arts and superstitions of infidel and idolatrous nations, in part derived from the Egyptians,..."

 

  Mayence ; the French name for Mainz a port in W Germany, capital of the Rhineland-Palatinate, at the confluence of the Main.

 

Lookit up ! 

 

The diabolical one was a German Jew .

 

 

 

Nungali

Quote

 

What does Abramelin teach?   Does he teach Egyptian ceremonial magic with ritual wands? 

 

 

Go back and read the bit  about the ritual I already posted .   Its from BOOK TWO , after many chapters it starts to describe the ritual .... what you are citing (with omissions ) is from book one .    You are either confused or trying to confuse .... or  trying to bluff your way through a subject you know nothing about and making mistakes as you are doing quick searches to try and get 'up to speed' just to criticise things  that dont fit in with your religious viewpoint

 

.

Edited October 29 by Nungali

[Nungali]

Edited October 29 by Nungali

[Cobie]

really

 

 

Edited October 29 by Cobie