Thrice Daily Posted November 17 The Qigong move “Push the Mountain” (推山, Tuī Shān) features in my Yijinjing practice and is a gentle yet powerful exercise that focuses on harnessing inner energy and building strength, stability, and flow within the body. It involves pressing the hands forward with an engaged, grounded stance, as though one were pushing an imaginary mountain, mine is done with quite a wide stance and the knees are bent together while the hands are clasped and pushing out palms facing outward. This move enhances strength in the shoulders, arms, and back, while also improving focus, relaxation, and energy (Qi) flow. Let’s break down the Chinese characters and ideographs for “Push the Mountain” (推山) and examine their meanings and relevance to the movement: Character Analysis 推 (Tuī) — "Push" Radicals and Composition: The character 推 is composed of the radical 手 (shǒu), meaning "hand," and 隹 (zhuī), which refers to a small bird or sometimes signifies movement or action. Symbolism in Qigong Context: The 手 (hand) radical highlights the physical action of pushing with the hands, a core aspect of the exercise. The overall meaning of Tuī implies a directed force or movement outward from the body, as if moving energy forward. In the context of Qigong, this "push" is not only physical but also an energetic projection, encouraging a strong flow of Qi from the practitioner’s center outward through the arms and palms. 山 (Shān) — "Mountain" Radicals and Composition: The character 山 is one of the simplest pictographs in Chinese, resembling three peaks or a mountain range. It has no additional radicals and represents the concept of a mountain directly. Symbolism in Qigong Context: In Qigong philosophy, the mountain symbolizes stability, endurance, and immovable strength. By "pushing the mountain," practitioners are encouraged to feel the solidity and grounded nature of their own stance, while simultaneously cultivating a sense of resilience and inner power. It can also imply a movement of Qi that is steady and unyielding, as powerful as a mountain. Context and Imagery In the “Push the Mountain” exercise, the movement typically involves a grounded stance with a slight bend in the knees, while the arms press forward in unison from the chest. This pressing motion activates the muscles in the shoulders, back, and arms, but it also emphasizes the intentional flow of Qi through the body's energy pathways. Mental Focus and Visualization: As practitioners “push the mountain,” they are encouraged to visualize their Qi flowing outward through the hands, projecting strength and stability. The exercise draws on both physical and mental strength, embodying the mountain's immovable and grounded nature. This grounding is key in Qigong, as it helps balance and anchor the practitioner’s energy. Qigong Benefits: “Push the Mountain” is known to improve upper body strength, shoulder flexibility, and Qi circulation in the chest and arms. It’s a calming movement that connects body and mind, encouraging a sense of rootedness (grounding) and an even flow of breath. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
liminal_luke Posted November 17 3 hours ago, Thrice Daily said: The Qigong move “Push the Mountain” (推山, Tuī Shān) features in my Yijinjing practice and is a gentle yet powerful exercise that focuses on harnessing inner energy and building strength, stability, and flow within the body. This sounds like the exercise in Robert Peng´s version of the Yi Jin JIng which he says is for working with the small intestine meridian. 1 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Shadow_self Posted November 17 1 hour ago, liminal_luke said: This sounds like the exercise in Robert Peng´s version of the Yi Jin JIng which he says is for working with the small intestine meridian. How the movement is done tends to generally matter more than what the movement actually is regards YJJ. Any video of this one? Key here being to relax the large muscles and stress the fascia in all movements For example, when moving up and down in the kua, you move up from the baihui dragging everything else up which opens the spine and you feel the resistance, its like pulling elastic Coming down, you pin the occiput, and let the tailbone sink which pulls the spine open downwards, and will have you sit into the kua properly, your tailbone will slightly tuck under when you release the mingmen and your knees will slightly bend themselves as the sit bones are stressed that will pull another layer of fascia Scapula need to be in the right position also You can kind of see the a fascia areas here in white (mingmen is whats circled) Over time you can create some very unusual forces inside that inflate and move the extremities themselves 3 1 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Thrice Daily Posted November 18 I'm in agreeance with you, although I'm not yet as methodical. That is great advice thankyou. In Chinese, the movement "Willow Tree Sways in the Wind" or "Swaying Willow" is often called: 柳树摆动 (Liǔ Shù Bǎi Dòng) 柳 (Liǔ): Willow 树 (Shù): Tree 摆动 (Bǎi Dòng): Swaying or swinging motion This term captures the imagery of a willow tree moving gently in the wind, emphasizing flexibility and fluidity in the movement. The particular movement I am trying to get the name of though I cant seem to find. I'm unsure if Swaying Willow is exactly it It is performed in wide stance arms clasped directly over head, palms facing outward, then with arms to ears bend left, bend right, and back to centre... I'd like to know the Chinese name for this if Swaying Willow is not totally accurate. Anybody now this one? Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Shadow_self Posted November 19 3 hours ago, Thrice Daily said: I'm in agreeance with you, although I'm not yet as methodical. That is great advice thankyou. In Chinese, the movement "Willow Tree Sways in the Wind" or "Swaying Willow" is often called: 柳树摆动 (Liǔ Shù Bǎi Dòng) 柳 (Liǔ): Willow 树 (Shù): Tree 摆动 (Bǎi Dòng): Swaying or swinging motion This term captures the imagery of a willow tree moving gently in the wind, emphasizing flexibility and fluidity in the movement. The particular movement I am trying to get the name of though I cant seem to find. I'm unsure if Swaying Willow is exactly it It is performed in wide stance arms clasped directly over head, palms facing outward, then with arms to ears bend left, bend right, and back to centre... I'd like to know the Chinese name for this if Swaying Willow is not totally accurate. Anybody now this one? I have never heard of this. All of my YJJ teachings are not based on sets, they are based on how it works in theory. The principals are then applied to whatever is done, be it sitting, standing or moving practice If you find me a video, I might be able to dissect it, though from what it sounds like, its pulling open the ribs, arms, intercostals etc 1 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
liminal_luke Posted November 19 4 hours ago, Thrice Daily said: It is performed in wide stance arms clasped directly over head, palms facing outward, then with arms to ears bend left, bend right, and back to centre... I'd like to know the Chinese name for this if Swaying Willow is not totally accurate. Anybody now this one? I don´t know that move, although it sounds a little bit like Wagging The Tail. In this move the fingers are interlaced and there are some movements in the center, to the left, to the right, and then to the center again. But the hands never go above the head so it couldn´t be the same. Seems to me there are different versions of the YJJ so we´re probably not practicing identical movements. 1 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Thrice Daily Posted November 19 13 hours ago, liminal_luke said: I don´t know that move, although it sounds a little bit like Wagging The Tail. In this move the fingers are interlaced and there are some movements in the center, to the left, to the right, and then to the center again. But the hands never go above the head so it couldn´t be the same. Seems to me there are different versions of the YJJ so we´re probably not practicing identical movements. Exactly , thanks for chiming on though. My current goal ‘as such’ is a to identify older Traditional Chinese characters once the movement can be [to the most part at least] defined in English terms, just like you attempted with “wagging the tail” in one way it is because I’d like to connect with the aspects of understanding and reasoning that would of existed closer to its inception in time, and homeland. Secondly I’m very interested to explore the more esoteric natures and applications within the movements and applied understanding through consciousness and alignment with energies. Think “balancing heaven and earth” for example with becomes a total treasure trove when we apply this kind of logic . I’m a firm believer in thinking that, arts such as this are not only individual and private practices, but are also living breathing practices that live here and now in space and time and continue to grow further nourishing our bodies and spirits. Firther adapting to the times we live in and the state and placement of objects in the living universe as they occupy space now… And that leads me to believe it’s cool to share a certain amount with each other on here which would otherwise perhaps remain private and secret. At least partially I’d like to discuss some of the more esoteric aspects of the practice, if indeed folk think there are any and resonate with what’s being said ❤️ ⭐️ 🌳 1 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Thrice Daily Posted November 19 14 hours ago, Shadow_self said: I have never heard of this. All of my YJJ teachings are not based on sets, they are based on how it works in theory. The principals are then applied to whatever is done, be it sitting, standing or moving practice If you find me a video, I might be able to dissect it, though from what it sounds like, its pulling open the ribs, arms, intercostals etc Thankyou, yeas it’s quite physical and that seems to be main function. At the moment the logic I have to a daily practice is , become soft, but not too soft. Still do some strength training for muscles to avoid becoming to jellyfied and losing too much strength and muscle mass. But not doing too much strength training as it would take away from development of Huang So far practice and reasoning has led me to only do Legs resistance strength training as my Yijinjing only has be in static standing postures of varying leg distances apart depending on the movement, so less stimulation of legs to upper body. My understanding is quite young on the principles as stated. Is there any advice you may give to the first stepping stones of understanding Yijinjing in terms of theory/practice or any reading you could quote of recommend with a link 🙏 most appreciated. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Thrice Daily Posted November 20 Sun Simiao (581–682 CE), often referred to as the "King of Medicine" in Chinese history, was a Taoist physician during the Tang Dynasty. Renowned for his profound contributions to Chinese medicine and Taoist health practices, he emphasized the integration of body, mind, and spirit for achieving optimal health. His writings on preventive care, exercise, and spiritual cultivation resonate deeply with the principles of the Yi Jin Jing (Muscle/Tendon Changing Classic), particularly in their shared focus on the harmony of internal energy and physical strength. Key Teachings of Sun Simiao and Parallels to Yi Jin Jing Stretching and Tendon Conditioning Sun Simiao: In his seminal work, Essential Prescriptions for Every Emergency, Sun advocated gentle exercises that stretch and condition the muscles and tendons to improve circulation and overall vitality. He believed this practice prevented stagnation of qi (energy) and maintained youthful vigor. Parallel with Yi Jin Jing: The Yi Jin Jing's sequences aim to stretch the tendons, strengthen muscles, and optimize the flow of qi. Both stress that flexibility and strength in the tendons are crucial for health and longevity. Breathing Techniques for Vital Energy Sun Simiao: He emphasized regulated breathing as a means to balance the body's qi and calm the mind, stating, “Breath controls the root of life; with practice, it becomes as steady as flowing water.” Parallel with Yi Jin Jing: Controlled breathing is fundamental in Yi Jin Jing exercises. Movements are synchronized with deep, diaphragmatic breathing to cultivate internal energy, mirroring Sun’s guidance on achieving harmony between breath and movement. Holistic Health and Longevity Sun Simiao: His approach to health combined physical activity, dietary discipline, herbal medicine, and meditation. He believed in nourishing both the body and spirit, echoing the Taoist idea of living in accordance with nature. Parallel with Yi Jin Jing: The Yi Jin Jing is not merely a physical regimen but a holistic practice that aligns body and mind, supporting longevity through balanced movement and spiritual focus. Gentle Yet Effective Movements Sun Simiao: He advised against overly strenuous exercise, favoring gentle, repetitive movements that could be sustained over a lifetime without causing harm. “Do not exhaust the body but nurture it with persistence and moderation.” Parallel with Yi Jin Jing: The Yi Jin Jing emphasizes flowing, non-aggressive movements designed to build strength gradually, avoiding the exhaustion Sun warned against. Integration of Medical and Martial Practices Sun Simiao: As a Taoist and physician, Sun understood the overlap between martial training and health cultivation. His daoyin exercises, rooted in Taoist practice, sought to heal the body while enhancing its capabilities. Parallel with Yi Jin Jing: The Yi Jin Jing, often linked to Shaolin martial arts, is a prime example of integrating health cultivation with martial strength, demonstrating how physical exercises can have profound healing effects. Mental and Emotional Harmony Sun Simiao: He advocated for emotional balance, warning against excessive anger or worry, as these could disrupt the flow of qi. Meditation and mindfulness were integral to his health prescriptions. Parallel with Yi Jin Jing: The Yi Jin Jing incorporates meditative focus, encouraging practitioners to unite mental calmness with physical exertion, fostering emotional and spiritual harmony. Taoist Philosophy in Both Traditions Both Sun Simiao's teachings and the Yi Jin Jing reflect a Taoist worldview where balance, simplicity, and alignment with natural rhythms are key. The Yi Jin Jing’s emphasis on adaptability and resilience mirrors Sun's medical philosophy, where health is achieved by harmonizing with the natural flow of qi in the universe. Sun Simiao (581–682 CE) is also credited with popularizing the Six Healing Sounds (Liu Zi Jue, 六字诀) which is a practice I love very much, though he may not have been the original creator. The origins of the Six Healing Sounds practice date back to earlier Taoist and medical traditions, but Sun played a pivotal role in systematizing and preserving these techniques in his writings, particularly in his medical compendia like the Essential Prescriptions for Every Emergency (Beiji Qianjin Yaofang, 備急千金要方).* Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Thrice Daily Posted November 24 The Nei Jing Tu (内经图), or Diagram of the Inner Scripture has caught me eye, you probably seen it already, it is an ancient Taoist illustration representing the human body as a microcosm of the universe, emphasizing the relationship between physical anatomy, energy flow (qi), and spiritual transformation. It serves as a map for inner alchemy and health practices, blending spiritual philosophy with practical techniques for cultivating vitality and harmony Key Features of the Nei Jing Tu: Body as a Landscape: The diagram portrays the body as a sacred landscape, with mountains, rivers, and pathways symbolizing the flow of energy (qi) and the meridians. It also features celestial imagery such as stars and moons to signify cosmic connections. Energetic Centers: The drawing emphasizes the Dantian (energy centers), the spine as the "stairway to heaven," and the flow of qi from the lower body upward toward enlightenment or spiritual realization. Meditative Practice: It highlights meditation and breathwork, including techniques like reverse breathing and visualization, to refine energy flow and achieve a balance between the physical and spiritual self. Connection to the Yi Jin Jing: Physical and Energetic Cultivation: Both the Nei Jing Tu and the Yi Jin Jing emphasize harmonizing physical strength with inner vitality. The Yi Jin Jing's tendon-stretching movements parallel the Nei Jing Tu's guidance on promoting qi flow along meridians. Holistic Approach: The Yi Jin Jing integrates physical movement, breath control, and mindfulness, which align closely with the Nei Jing Tu's Taoist principles of balancing the body, mind, and spirit. Transformative Goals: While the Yi Jin Jing focuses on strengthening muscles and tendons, it also fosters the smooth flow of qi, resonating with the Nei Jing Tu's goal of spiritual and physical transformation. Questions; Does the he Nei Jing Tu provide a theoretical and symbolic framework for practices like the Yi Jin Jing? It shows how physical exercises are part of a larger Taoist worldview of interconnectedness, is this helpful in Yijinjing practice? By practicing Yi Jin Jing, one not only strengthens the body but also aligns with the energetic pathways and cosmic principles depicted in the Nei Jing Tu, do you agree? Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Thrice Daily Posted November 24 Ah I was looking for 十大功法 and thought it was refering to a specific set of movements that were closely related to Jijinjing, it was in an old Martial arts magazine and read; " and Shi Da Gong Fa, meaning "Ten Great Skills," an internal exercise to make the body hard as iron, and a very important skill in developing hard chi kung breaking skills. What Yijinjing and the other forms of chi kung have in common" After looking it up though it seems I've found it, it is highly relatable to the topic at hand though imo... 十大功法 (Shi Da Gong Fa) translates as "The Ten Great Techniques" in Chinese and is a traditional set of Qigong exercises that focuses on cultivating health, vitality, and spiritual awareness. It combines movement, breathing, and mental focus to harmonize the body's energy (Qi) and promote overall well-being. These methods often form a comprehensive system for physical and energetic development. Overview of Shi Da Gong Fa The "Ten Great Techniques" are rooted in classical Qigong practices, and while specific techniques might vary across traditions, they generally include the following key aspects: Posture Alignment (站桩 - Zhan Zhuang): Standing meditation to cultivate inner stillness and body alignment. Breathing Techniques (调息 - Tiao Xi): Controlled breathing to regulate the flow of Qi. Energy Circulation (小周天 - Xiao Zhou Tian): Moving energy through meridians to strengthen the body's internal network. Dynamic Movements (导引 - Daoyin): Stretching and movements to open energy channels. Spiritual Focus (调心 - Tiao Xin): Mental focus to enhance mindfulness and spiritual connection. Five Animal Frolics (五禽戏 - Wu Qin Xi): Movements inspired by animals to develop flexibility and vitality. Internal Alchemy (内丹 - Nei Dan): Advanced methods for cultivating spiritual energy. Healing Sounds (六字诀 - Liu Zi Jue): Using specific vocalizations to balance organ energy. Strengthening Techniques (铁布衫 - Tie Bu Shan): Developing resilience and protecting the body. Tai Chi Principles (太极 - Tai Ji): Incorporating fluid, circular movements to balance Yin and Yang. Historical and Practical Context These practices are deeply influenced by Daoist and Traditional Chinese Medicine (TCM) principles, emphasizing the harmony of body, mind, and spirit. Historically, they were developed for self-healing, longevity, and spiritual cultivation. They are often taught in schools of martial arts, Daoist monasteries, or as part of personal wellness routines. Shi Da Gong Fa integrates physical conditioning with meditative practices, making it highly versatile and accessible to individuals at different skill levels. Modern adaptations sometimes simplify the methods to focus on stress relief, relaxation, and health benefits Also in my stumbling's I happened upon this video, it is not exactly what i'd searched for but it does display a harder style routine that is more what I am into when looking at Yijinjing. Nice routine... Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Thrice Daily Posted November 24 Okay, just came across a real corker of a resource. Remember seeing this website years ago. I'm gong to paste in the quotes on Yijinjing here, as they are really fantastic and in case something happens to his website (like so many other websites on Taoism and Martial Arts) it will still be able to be read here in years to come... Fantastic resource and can be viewed here https://www.egreenway.com/qigong/yijinjing.htm thanks to Michael Garofalo, I do hope he is okay with me sharing it here,,, Quotations "The basic purpose of Yijinjing is to turn flaccid and frail sinews and tendons into strong and sturdy ones. The movements of Yijinjing are at once vigorous and gentle. Their performance calls for a unity of will and strength, i.e. using one’s will to direct the exertion of muscular strength. It is coordinated with breathing. Better muscles and tendons means better health and shape, more resistance, flexibility, endurance, and is obtained as follows: postures influences the static and nervous structure of the body stretching muscles and sinews affects organs, joints, meridians and Qi torsion affects metabolism and Jing production breathing produce more and better refined Qi active working gives back balance and strength to body and mind (brain, nervous system and spirit). Power and endurance are of paramount importance if we look at becoming qualified in whatever practice we choose, be it Tuina, martial arts, or simply better health and wisdom. Already another known Qigong system, Baduanjin, in its more radical and strong forms was used in the past from schools of Xingyiquan and Taijiquan as bodily preparation to fighting arts, in order to make body strong and flexible. Baduanjin still remains the first, entry-level routine to learn at Shaolin training schools in Song Mountains. We can still see today Japanese Kata like Sanchin, postures and forms like Siunimtao in Wingchung, “Iron thread” in Hung Gar and all sorts of Neigong in Neijia. Martial artists need to be powerful in the martial practice, like non-martial people need to be healthy. But there is also something supple and flexible inside of Yijinjing. Movements are energetic and intense, but you can see through a kind of peace. Yijinjing unifies in fact Yi (intention) with Li (strength), consciousness (yang) with muscular force (yin). The mind is free from thoughts, has a correct and well-disposed attitude, the breathing is harmonious. Internal and external movement must be coordinated, like movement with relaxation. Externally must be fortification; inside must be purification; unifying matter and spirit. Some classic recurring points of Yijinjing can be described as follows: - Most of the movements use open palms, fists are used only for stretching the tendons. - The name of exercises changes, but often the basic idea of movement remains the same. I.e. Wei Tuo greets and offers something (Nanjing Ac. of Tuina); Wei Tuo offers gifts to the sky (Liu Dong); General Skanda holds the Cudgel (Zong Wu-Li Mao). - Movements are done standing, sometimes bending forward, but never lying or sitting. - Eyes are always open, never closed. - Movements are slow but full and tensed, face and body shows relaxed attitude. - All directions of the upper body section (especially shoulders) are active and moved. - Dynamic tension rules the moves. - All parts of the body works together. - There are different ways of practicing the same Yijinjing form, according to the basic rules, to the body shape, to the time of practice and to the general health conditions. According to traditional verbal formulas, we have that: - The first year of training gives back physical and mental vitality - The second year enhances blood circulation and nurtures meridians - The third year allows flexibility to muscles and nurtures the organs - The forth year meridians are better and viscera are nurtured - The fifth year the marrow is washed and the brain is nurtured The Five rules of Yijinjing are: - Quietness Like lake water reflects the moon, a calm spirit allows energy to move inside the body - Slowness In order to use and flex muscles deeply, to get maximum extension and move Qi and Xue, slow movements are required - Extension Each movement must be brought to the maximum - Pause Efficacy comes through waiting and keeping tension for longer time - Flexibility Limbs and trunk must be extended so that blood and energy can circulate, so we have flexibility. Breathing in Yijinjing is a controversial point. Modern sources insist on a deep, forced, reverse breathing in order to develop power. Other sources, and among them Robert W. Smith, in his article on the J.A.M.A. in 1996, suggest that there are differences between the northern and the southern way of breath. The southern systems seem not to have a deep understanding and good use of breathing and working on Qi as energy. In his work on “Breathing in Taiji and other fighting arts”, Smith analyses not only Taiji veterans and classics, but also known fighters out of his personal experience, and invariably the right kind of breathing, be it for martial or for health purposes, is located between classic abdominal breathing and a slow, unconscious breathing, where there is place for sudden explosions, typical of martial arts and hard blows." - Yi Jin Jing - Wikipedia "The Changing Tendons Exercise (Yi Jin Jing) is another form of exercise handed down from ancient times. In Chinese yi means change, jin means "tendons and sinews", while jing means "methods". This is a relatively intense form of exercise that aims at strengthening the muscles and tendons , so promoting strength and flexibility, speed and stamina, balance and coordination of the body. This exercise pays great attention to the coordination of movements, respiration and mind so as to guarantee that qi circulates freely and smoothly. As with most exercises, there is an enormous variety in form, the most popular being the "12-postures of Changing Tendons" devised by Pan Wei in the Qing dynasty (AD 1644-1911)." - Changing Tendons Exercise "The Essence of Yi Jin Jing: The Yi Jin Jing exercises are a form of wai dan (external chi developing) qigong that uses yi, focused intent and visualization to develop local chi and increase chi circulation. This later evolved into the Lohan Shi-Ba Zhang (18 Priest-Scholar Palms) Martial Arts that formed the foundation of Chinese temple boxing and Shaolin arts. In Chinese medicine, tendons generally represent meridians or pathways for the energy to flow. Marrow refers to the heart. Hence, Yi Jin Jing refers to changing tendons or opening up the channels throughout the body and cleansing them of all blockages. Once the blockages are removed the chi can then flow naturally and health is restored. With regular practice of the Yi Jin Jing, the practitioner can not only maintain good health but can also develop a strong immunity against almost any form of disease and even deterioration due to age. This is the origin of Da Mo Qigong. This internal art is still practiced today, but it has developed into a set of exercises designed for health maintenance and to treat chronic disease, in addition to promoting its original goal of meditation and enlightenment." - Qigong "Muscle-Tendon Changing (chin.: Yi Jin Jing 易筋经) is one of the Venerable Bodhidharma’s timeless teachings and have been considered the key to long-lasting youth. The term Yijinjing can be translated also as regeneration of the Body and Tendon-Transformation and Marrow-Purification method. Bodhidharma’s Yi Jin Jing is one of the most well kept Martial Arts (chin. wugōng 武功)technique of the Songshan Shaolin Monastery (chin.: Sōngshān Shàolínsì 嵩山少林寺). Practicing Bodhidharma’s Yi Jin Jing improve the external strength (chin.: Jìn 劲) of the body but also the body flexibility (chin.: róuxìng 柔性.) The Yi Jin Jing taught the Shaolin Monks (chin.: Shàolínsēng 少林僧) how to build their internal energy (chin.: qi 气) to an abundant level and use it to improve health and change their physical bodies from weak to strong. After the Monks practiced the Yi Jin Jing exercises, they found that not only did they improve their health, but also they also greatly increased their strength. When this training was integrated into the martial arts forms, it increased their martial abilities. This change marked one more step in the growth of the Shaolin Martial Arts (chin.: Shàolín wugōng 少林武功.)" - Yi Jin Jing "Yi Jin Jing should be practiced with a relaxed spirit and a peaceful mind. Practitioners do not have to particularly initiate movements by the mind or focus on the intended parts of the body. Rather, the mind follows the movements, and should be coordinated with the circulation of Qi with the body's movements. Gentle and easy breathing without any gasping or obstruction is required to relax the spirit and body, make the mind peaceful and coordinate the body's motions. Noisy breathing, gasping and distorted nostrils tend to upset the mind, disturb the balance and make the movements uncoordinated. The softness and toughness of the exercise movements interchange throughout the practice. When stretched or relaxed, they display a dialectical relationship of a unity of opposites, in the same way as the reactions of Yin and Yang, the two opposing and interactive aspects of the body according to traditional Chinese medicine. Various movements in the exercise require the practitioners to relax for a while after strength is applied, and suitable force is required after softness or relaxation. In this way, the movements will not be stiff and restrained or slack and fatigued. While making a distinction between softness and toughness, the exercise aims to achieve a good combination of firmness with gentleness. The movements should be appropriately firm and gentle instead of going to extremes. Otherwise, excessive force could lead to stiff and restrained movements, thus affecting breathing and the mind. On the other hand, excessive softness or relaxation tends to cause slackness, also weakening the intended effect." - Practice Tips of Yi Jin Jing "Published in various editions (and with increasingly more ancient prefaces) since the seventeenth century, the text's Twelve Tendon Exercises enhance internal muscular functioning rather than strength or vigor. Each is called by a mythological or illustrative name and undertaken from a standing position in which practitioners hold certain positions while tensing the muscles to strengthen the tendons. Arms, leggs, and torso are engaged, and the entire body is made suppler and more open. The mind is kept calm and relaxed, the breath is deep and slow. Positions should be held for up to nine breaths." - Livia Kohn, "Chinese Healing Exercises," 2008, p. 195. "For most of these exercises, my Shifu likes us to use “back breathing” (bei-shi huxi), which is similar to pre-natal/”reverse” breathing, but with less expansion of the front of the chest and more concentration on expanding the back. The idea that so-called “natural” breathing should also be called “Buddhist breathing” (which seems to be common) seems completely wrong to me, not only because we use multiple methods of breathing in Buddhist qigong, but because Buddhist qigong actually prefers the pre-natal and back breathing to the natal (at least, according to Zhou it does)." - Dave Chesser, Introduction to Yi Jin Jing "Yi Jin Jing (Tendon-Muscle Strengthening Exercises) is a health and fitness exercise handed down from ancient China. In Chinese yi means change, jin means "tendons and sinews", while jing means "methods". This is a relatively intense form of exercise that aims at strengthening the muscles and tendons, so promoting strength and flexibility, speed and stamina, balance and coordination of the body. This exercise pays great attention to the coordination of movements, respiration and mind so as to guarantee that qi circulates freely and smoothly. As with most exercises, there is an enormous variety in form, the most popular being the "12-postures of Changing Tendons" devised by Pan Wei in the Qing dynasty (AD 1644-1911). Health Qigong--Yi Jin Jing features extended, soft and even movements displaying a graceful charm, and it puts focus on the turning and flexing of the spine, thus invigorating the limbs and internal organs. These movements have been proved to be able to improve health and fitness, prevent diseases, lengthen life and improve the intellect. In particular, practice of the Yi Jin Jing exercises has very impressive effects on the respiratory system, flexibility, balance and muscular strength. It can also prevent and cure diseases of the joints, digestive system, cardiovascular system and nervous system. From a country where a thousand years are still considered recent history, Yi Jin Jing is truly an ancient art. Based on fragments of historical records, this health exercise was introduced in China more than 3000 years ago. Developed and refined through the ages, Yi Jin Jing, for so long shrouded in mystery, has finally made it to the 21st century in its full glory. Benefits: 1) Yi Jin Jing exercises has very impressive effects on the respiratory system, flexibility, balance and muscular strength. It can also prevent and cure diseases of the joints, digestive system, cardiovascular system and nervous system. 2) It strongly engages the practitioner’s muscle force; this is why one can achieve noticeable results like increased muscle tone and stamina in quite a short time. 3) Those who are desk-bound, spend too long in front of the computer or TV, driving etc., can greatly benefit from the YiJin, as they counter the negative effects of a sedentary and physically inactive lifestyle. 4) It improves body posture and correcting postural and joint problems. Importantly, when learned correctly, it can help undo the negative side-effects often experienced following incorrect practice of various QiGong or Meditation techniques. YiJin is a tonic for the body and mind that lead to an improved energy, physical fitness and strength." - Yi Jin Jing "The sinew-transforming exercises, a literal translation from the Chinese name Yiji Jing, are a traditional form of such Qigong exercises for overcoming disease and prolonging life of very ancient origin. The full name of Yijinjing is called the Bodhidharma Yijinjing, one component part of Shaolin external Qigong. To practice the Yijinjing frequently can recuperate the Yin and Yang, keep fit, dispel diseases and prolong life. According to Classics of Internal Medicine, "All disease are latent in the condition of the qi, or vital energy." It is said that if one can keep yin and yang, the two opposite vital properties that permeate the whole body, in harmonious proportion, accordingly nourishing one's blood and vital energy, then one can ward off disease, extend one's years and ensure a long and healthy life free from senile decline. The beneficial effects of Qi Gong on health are therefore well established. Qi Gong exercises of this tradition may be divided into the "quiet," which usually consist of conscious breathing movement to "exhale the stale and take in the fresh," and the "active," which consist of the art of limb movement. These exercises combining body movement with mental regulation are considered a necessary means to promoting the free function of the vital energy and blood circulation. Perform such exercises every day, and one's health is ensured. These are the ways the ancients preserved their health, methods." - 14 Series Sinew Transforming Exercises "I learned it with the older transliteration of "I Chin Ching." The set I know consists of 49 postures done with hard chi breathing where you "hiss". It is good for health but also a very intense strength, flexibility, and balance workout. The first posture is the same as the one stated above, making fists. from there it goes into all sorts of difficult postures in which no part of the body is left out. To me it seems to be a blending of chinese hard chi kung with indian yoga, which fits in well with the story of its creation by Ta Mo. The way it works (supposedly) is by creating muscle tension in specific body parts, then using the breathing and concentration to send the chi there, where the tension traps it and causes it to build up progressively. Once you do all the postures every part of the body has been flooded with chi. Without even considering the chi aspect, its still an enormously difficult physical workout." - Kung Fu Forum on Yi Jin Jing "Examine these methods. There are twelve illustrations. From the time of the Five Kingdoms, Whom has really learned this method? Ta-mo came from the West, And spread the doctrines at Shao-lin-ssu. In Sung there was Yueh-hou As an example. To cure disease and lengthen life's span, These exercises are unique and incomparable." - The Twelve Diva Positions, "Chinese Healing Arts: Internal Kung Fu," 1986, p. 177 "It's said that the Physique-Changing Scripture (Yi Jin Jing), one of the traditional Qigong exercises in China, was brought in by Dharma and then spread in the Shaolin Temple. Yi means accommodate, change or shed, Jin refers to bones and muscles, and Jing is guide or code, which together means the way to change your physique." - Shaolin Kung Fu "The earliest description of Yi Jin Jing exercises can be found on a 2000 years old brocade painting named 'Illustration of Qi Circulation' (Dao Yin), which was unearthed in the 1970s from an ancient tomb in Changsha, Hunan, China. From 526 AD on, monks of the Shaolin Monastery played an important role in the evolution of the Yi Jin Jing exercises. The earliest account of the modern 12-movement exercises is included in the Illustrations of Internal Exercise compiled by Pan Wei in 1858 in the Qing Dynasty. As traditional Yi Jin Jing relies heavily on the traditional Chinese medicine theory of the Five Elements - metal, wood, water, fire, earth - different school of the exercises have evolved, emphasizing this aspect in many works. The Health Qigong Yi Jin Ying absorbed the cream of the traditional 12-routine Yi Jin Ying exercises together with a modern scientific approach. The movements form a continuous integrity, focusing on tendon stretching and bone flexing and combining softness with strength. An essential part of the routines is natural breathing and the integration of mind and body with a relaxed spirit to make the circulation of the vital energy (qi) as unimpeded as possible. Yi Jin Jing movements require a full range of stretching, bending, flexing and twisting in multi-directional and wide-ranging motions of the bones and related joints. As the bones are flexed, the muscle groups, tendons and ligaments are also stretched. This improves the blood circulation, nutrition supersession in the soft tissues of the motion-related areas, increases the flexibility and pliability of such soft tissues as muscles, tendons, ligaments and enhances the mobility of the bones, joints and muscles. The exercises are centered on the twisting, flexing, and stretching of the spine, with the waist as the axis and are conducted at a slow and even pace. Such movements help to stimulate spinal and nerve cords to make them function more effectively, together with the exercise of limbs and internal organs. Strength, when required, is applied in a gradual manner and the muscles should be relaxed to combine strength with tenderness. The Yi Jin Ying movements have been proven to be able to improve health, fitness, prevent diseases, lengthen life and improve intellect. Regular, correct practice has very impressive effects on the respiratory system, flexibility, balance and muscular strength. It may also help to prevent and cure diseases of the joints, digestive, cardiovascular and nervous system." - Health Qigong Canada "1. Wei Tuo Presents a Club I: Stand upright, place the palms together in front of the heart, push them together with vigor while keeping the legs tense and grabbing the floor with toes and heels. 2. Wei Tuo Presents a Club II: Keeping the legs and toes engaged, stretch the arms out to the sides, tensing the muscles. Keep your mind calm and your breath subtle. 3. Wei Tuo Presents a Club III: Lifting the arms to support heaven with palms facing up, look up. Still keep the legs engaged, the jaw tight, the mind calm. 4. Plucking the Stars to Move the Dipper: Place one hand on the lower back while raising the other above the head, palm facing up and looking up at the extended hand. Press hard in both directions. Change sides. 5. Pulling Nine Bulls' Tails: Take a step forward with one leg while placing the other in lunge position. With one arm reach forward at shoulder level, with the other reach back in a slight twist, keeping both wrists bent. Push hard. Change sides." - Livia Kohn, Chinese Healing Exercises, 2008, p. 196. "A Shaolin monk took eight groups of the most powerful movements from these two forms [Yi Jin Jin and Xi Su Jing]. This form is called Ba (eight) Duan (best) Jin (movements) or The Eight Treasures. This is the form that is taught in this book. When my Master transmitted it to me he told me it was one of the most powerful Qigong forms for health. Since coming to the West, I have seen many different interpretations of the Eight Treasures. This version is the Buddhist form that I was taught at the Shaolin Temple, which I have authenticated against the ancient Shaolin books." - Shifu Yan Lei, Instant Health: The Shaolin Workout for Longevity, p. 41. "The Yi Jin Jing is one of the most widely practiced conditioning exercise sets in Chinese martial arts. Its long existence and its adoption by a diverse collection of martial artists have lead to numerous variations. The set is intended to build flexibility and strength in the tendons and muscles while developing a coordinated strength from the ground. Additionally, the progressive stretch/release cycles promote relaxation and are said to stimulate qi flow throughout the body. The name of the set can be translated as Yi – transform/change, Jin – muscles/tendons/fascia, Jing – Classic/classical method. Most of the exercises follow a coordination of progressive extension from the ground, and relaxation back to the ground: Toes lightly grip with a suction feeling, Body comes forward slightly activate the calves, Use a feeling of drawing up to the buttocks, Lightly tuck the buttocks up toward the dan tien, Elongate the torso, Stretch up the back, shoulders, arms; Release the stretch using the opposite sequence." - Yi Jin Jing. Rochester Chen Style Taijiquan. "The histories of the Chinese arts taught at the Shaolin Wu-Yi institute have their origins in China during the Liang dynasty in the year 527AD. At this time a Buddhist monk named Da Mo traveled from India to Honan province in Northern China to spread his teachings. Upon arrival the emperor did not favor the teachings of Da Mo so the Monk sought out a nearby Buddhist Temple located at the foot of the Shao Shih Mountain, called the Shaolin Temple. Upon arrival at the temple Da Mo found that the monks were very weak due to many hours of meditation without any physical exercise. In order to improve the level of spiritual cultivation Da Mo left the temple and went into seclusion nearby where he spent the next nine years in deep meditation pondering the difficulties of the monks. When Da Mo returned he had created a set of exercises to greatly improve the physical health of the Shaolin Monks as well as lead them toward deeper meditation and spiritual cultivation. This set of exercises can be divided into three forms. The first form is called the “Shi Ba Lohan Shou” or Eighteen Hands of the Enlightened One, this form consisted of eighteen different positions designed to strengthen the body as well as increase flexibility, coordination and focus. The next form was called the “Yi Jin Jing” or Muscle & Tendon Conditioning Set. The Yi Jin Jing was a Chi Gung form which consisted of a series of hand and arm movements done in coordination with deep breathing and intense concentration. The Yi Jin Jing greatly improves the external strength as well as the health of the internal organs. The last set was called the “Shi Sui Jing” or Bone Marrow & Brain Washing Form. The Shi Sui Jing was the most advanced and complex form left by Da Mo, its purpose was to use the energy built up through the previous two forms in order to reach a deep state of meditation in order to raise up the spirit during meditation and reach a state of enlightenment. Da Mo died in 539AD and was recognized as an enlightened being." - History of the Shaolin Wu-Yi Institute "March 3rd, in the spring, Two years passed Zenguan period in Tang Dynasty. Written by the General Li Jing Note: This preface introduces the story of how the book Yi Jin Jing came from and the effect of practice. The text is written in the way with a dense religion color and readers must distinguish and understand the real meaning. The introduction of volume One: The main idea of the master Bodhidharma: there are two elemental steps to gain "Zhengguo",called "Chuji", one is "Qingxu", the other is "Tuohuan". To achieve Qingxu, one has to have no any confusion in his feeling and spirit; to achieve Tuohuan, he or she will have got no obstacle, so he can be samadhi (enter into trance). Knowing this, one is said to have got the foundation of work. Qingxu is the same as Xisui; the Tuohuan is the same as Yijing. The idea of Xisui is: through the whole life, a human being always undergoes love and passion. If he cannot resist on refusing all the temptation for his life, he will fail and degenerate. If he wants to gain the Prajna and the gnosis, he must first purely purify his all organs and bones. Only by doing this, can he begin his lesson of mortification and reach the Prajna at last. Without this process of the entry, one is said to have no foundation. To obtain Xisui is to clean one's inside feeling and spirit; the aim of Yi Jing is to strengthen and enhance one's body. If one can both be Qingxu inside and strong outside, it will be easy for him to reach the state of the door of Shen?. The idea ofYi Jin Jing is: All the tendons and bones of human are formed in one's foetus state, .... someone's tendon is loose, or disorder, or weak, or contracted, or strong, or easy, or in harmonic situation, all sorts of tendons are decided by the forming of foetus. It is said about the tendons that the looseness of them means ill; the disorder means thin; the rotten means impotent; being weak means slack; being contracted means dying; being easy means long; being powerful means strong; being harmonic means healthy. If one has no Qingxu inside but on the contrary with lots of obstacles within, how could he enter into the fight access? In reality, to enter into the gate of Taoism, changing the tendon and muscle to strengthen and enhance one's body will be the first of all, or one will deviate from Taoism and could not reach its aim any more. So it is what Yi Jin Jing says, it is of Yin and Yang, being negative and positive aspects in Taoism. Yi means change, and the change between Yin and Yang is like the shadow of moon and sun in the bottle, or such as the Yin and Yang display on the palm although. The key is up to the practicer, as the two aspects are both up to human's will. Anything could be changed indeed, falsehood one could be changed into truth; coldness one could be changed into hotness; something strong can change into something weak; quiet can change into activeness; being downward can change into being up; pressing can change into ease; the passive can change into the positive; danger can be changed into safety; the trouble can change to be managed; the misfortune can change into good fortune; the dying can be changed to the survivable. The "Qishu" can be changed by will to save. All the things in the world can be changed back or forward, so do the tendon and bone of human. The tendon is out of the bone marrow, within the skin muscle. There are all tendons, relative to each other all over the body to pass through and control the vim and other things as the outside aid of the spirit. Like the shoulder can carry, the hand can tweak, the foot can step, all these are the functions of the tendons. So the tendon can not permitted to be loose, to get into disorder, to get rotten, weak, or contracted and so on. What about one with such illness as Lao? how could he enter into the Taoism? The Master taught the method to cure them, to let the disorder becomes normal. Then, the weak becomes strong, the loose becomes harmonized, the contracted becomes long, the rotten becomes powerful. In a word, the ill body becomes strong and solid. That function of changing is called "Yi". The body is the base of the benefit and good, so Yin and Yang are controlled and can be mastered by human whatever. If one can maintain his wellbeing from the ill effect of Yin and Yang, he can also change his normal body into the strongest as hard as the diamond, with no any confusion inside, no obstacle outside. At this state, he can go into Dhyana (concentration) and also can go out from Dhyana. His work is not a trivial matter, but because of the sequence of the process and the doctrines having the inside and outside aspects of two. This can be examined in each from the regular daily life and the produce process of the medicine and apparatus. The Novice must first burn the fragrant to show his promise and determination, being brave and strong to do the lesson as the doctrine told. If one can persist in it ,it is sure for him to reach the door of "Shen". Bancimidi (the Sangha) notes, the text is the original idea of great master of Bodhidharma, and it is the general idea of the Yi Jin. This translation script is the same meaning as the original without any change. The volume One is about the meaning of the book content in detail. If can meet other great masters from India, please ponder over it again." - Book of Scripture of the Yi Jin Jing from Shaolin Revelations "The Yi Jin Jing exercises are a form of wai dan (external chi developing) qigong that uses yi, focused intent and visualization to develop local chi and increase chi circulation. This later evolved into the Lohan Shi-Ba Zhang (18 Priest-Scholar Palms) Martial Arts that formed the foundation of Chinese temple boxing and Shaolin arts. In Chinese medicine, tendons generally represent meridians or pathways for the energy to flow. Marrow refers to the heart. Hence, Yi Jin Jing refers to changing tendons or opening up the channels throughout the body and cleansing them of all blockages. Once the blockages are removed the chi can then flow naturally and health is restored. With regular practice of the Yi Jin Jing, the practitioner can not only maintain good health but can also develop a strong immunity against almost any form of disease and even deterioration due to age. This is the origin of Da Mo Qigong. This internal art is still practiced today, but it has developed into a set of exercises designed for health maintenance and to treat chronic disease, in addition to promoting its original goal of meditation and enlightenment." - Qigong Martial Arts Origins "Today the most respected routine is that of Wang Zuyuan, composed of 12 exercises, and has been adopted by the most authoritative Academies of Chinese Medicine in China. Chang Renxia together with Chang Weizhen proposed an alternative 14 series, which can be of interest for the therapeutic effects he promises. Deng Ming Dao presents a version of 24 series, but with another name, Xisuijing. In fact, another point of crossing is the relationship between the Xisuijing (Method or Classic of Marrow Transforming and Cleansing) and the Yijinjing. Some authors tend to use those two names for the same routine; others keep things separated and invoke different results and different effects on the body; other authors have written different books and created different theories, sometimes not just for the quest of the final truth. Still the source is the famed name of Bodhidharma. The 12 Posture Moving Exercise kept to this day is something that Wang Zuyuan (circa 1850) learned at Shaolin Temple at the Song Mountain. It is somewhat different from the original “Picture of stationary exercise” and “Guide to the art of attack” (as Guangdong sources refers). Some specialists (Liu Dong) refer of a later integration of Yijinjing, Daoyin, Tuna and XingQi methods. However Wang’s 12 Postures found to be concise through practice and helps to enhance one’s physical health. As the name implies, “sinew transforming exercise” is the method to train the tendons and muscles. The exercise is designed according to the course and the characteristics of Qi circulation in the 12 regular channels and Du and Ren channels. During practice, Qi and blood usually circulates appropriately with proper speed and no sluggishness or stagnation. Because of this efficacy, Yijinjing has existed for centuries as a favorite with the populace and is still widely used in sanatoria and hospitals for therapeutic purposes. Two ancient written and illustrated routines remained, one from Chen Yi’s “A collection of Annals” published during the Ming Dynasty (1368-1644) and another more recent published in 1882, from “Internal Work Illustrated”, that of Wang Zuyuan. The 12 Posture Moving Exercise most closely describes what is called the 12 fists of Tamo in Many southern martial arts most notably Hung Gar & Wing chun. Ascribing the 12 exercises to 12 animals that Tamo studied after his 9 years of meditation. The exercises were developed based on the movements of the 12 animals. These exercises healed the sickly monks of the Shaolin Temple, and contribute to the many animal based martial arts in China." - Yi Jin Jing - Wikipedia "The breathing technique we will use with Yi Jin Jing Qigong is the Ming Men Breathing technique: 1) Inhale slowly and expand the lower abdomen. 2) Push out your navel and pull up your perineum and anus towards the expanded navel. 3) Without exhaling, pull your navel toward your spine and push your anus towards the Ming Men point on your spine. 4) Exhale slowly as you hold the pull. 5) release and begin again." - Eric Yudelove, 100 Days to Better Health, Good Sex and Long Life Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Thrice Daily Posted November 26 Looking at the yellow emperor classic has been interesting, I've moved forwards to try to get to the next most intriguing part of Taoist history that might point at the yijinjing, I've bumped into Zongheng (宗衡) who is supposed to have originated a 12 posture technique. Has anyone heard about this or practiced it. I'd like to find examples of it. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Thrice Daily Posted Friday at 11:10 PM You know since returning to the practice of Yijinjing I've noticed some new ways to perform the exercises. The breakthroughs are coming and my body feels much younger and more youthful spring has returned to my step. I'm also faster and my nerves are letting me be quicker in sequential actions again, like any technical movements made up of many motions, very swift and with a cool calmness. I've been starting to see in the practice I've got so much progress available with the system I'm using and much more to gain in each stretch. I guess I'll find out over time. My plan is to use yijinjing for around half the year, then return to strength training . I enjoy strength training and want to maximise on strength gains while I'm younger. If however next year when starting the Yijinjing again I feel a regression in my suppleness and feel a sense of starting again rather than adding to the progress of this year. I may cut the weights and attempt to stick to yijinjing to a couple of years and really build on it. It's hard to say for sure as i've not had experience really mixing with weight training, Have you any experience? I was mixing weights in at the same time but the stiffness was a distraction to stretch back through and the systemic fatigue was having a negative effect on the yijinjing. Just found this nice little set and thought i'd share, its worth watching for 4 minutes if you are interested. Enjoy This is a nice set , very dynamic. 1 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Sahaja Posted Monday at 06:42 PM Actually instead of all the movements just stand and let the flesh hang off the bone and relax all muscular tension letting all your weight go to your feet (bones up/flesh down -key YJJ principle).. Eventually energy will move back up your legs into the torso on its own and your tissues will expand from pressurized qi and open, often quite dramatically. My understanding is that this kind of opening (sinew changing) is not accessible through external stretching and movement or from visualization or from direction with your intention, only through the internal movement of pressurized qi facilitated by release of tension, receptive attention inside and internal energetic connection between points. This process allows for new tissues to form in the space created by the pressure that will increase the amount of qi in the body and for tissue to connect internally throughout the body which becomes a repeating cycle building on itself. With correct positioning of the body’s center over the Dan tian, this will also develop at the same time providing an energetic anchor and internal qi storage/pump. After this initial change (takes 3 to 5 years) , working with energy in the body is relatively simple, often just involving a simple hand mudra or positioning of the palm or a release of tension. Without this internal change facilitated by pressurized qi all these external movement and breath forms at best just relax you, increase flexibility and help normal circulation - which isn’t bad and for sedentary people can be a game changer. They are also useful as preparation for the deeper work, but they are not the deeper work. My understanding is that the goal of sinew changing (channel opening) and marrow washing (changing the brain and heart) and the third (going beyond the mind) is a lot deeper and more profound than stretching and breathing and takes one well beyond normal good healthy functioning. Just as yoga is much more than just asana, the internal arts of East Asia are much more than just Daoyin exercises. My understanding is that the true original YJJ and related treatises from the 5th/6th century are not in the public domain if they currently even exist at all. I don’t believe documents prepared hundreds of years later showing them as physical exercises are valid representations of the original YJJ and related works. What we have left of it today are it’s principles that have elements built into certain internal development practices of martial arts and into other internal arts practices. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Thrice Daily Posted Monday at 09:07 PM 2 hours ago, Sahaja said: Actually instead of all the movements just stand and let the flesh hang off the bone and relax all muscular tension letting all your weight go to your feet (bones up/flesh down -key YJJ principle).. Eventually energy will move back up your legs into the torso on its own and your tissues will expand from pressurized qi and open, often quite dramatically. My understanding is that this kind of opening (sinew changing) is not accessible through external stretching and movement or from visualization or from direction with your intention, only through the internal movement of pressurized qi facilitated by release of tension, receptive attention inside and internal energetic connection between points. Are you certain about this Sahaja? Is it more about Static Postures? or is it possible you feel it is easier to achieve the results this way? All the sets I have seen have been moving, do you believe the yjj sets were all adapted from Static Postures and are inferior. 2 hours ago, Sahaja said: This process allows for new tissues to form in the space created by the pressure that will increase the amount of qi in the body and for tissue to connect internally throughout the body which becomes a repeating cycle building on itself. With correct positioning of the body’s center over the Dan tian, this will also develop at the same time providing an energetic anchor and internal qi storage/pump. After this initial change (takes 3 to 5 years) , working with energy in the body is relatively simple, often just involving a simple hand mudra or positioning of the palm or a release of tension. That makes good sense, 3-5 years, what would you call consistent practice for that 3-5 years, What might a weekly practice rota look like to you? Interested to know your opinion. 2 hours ago, Sahaja said: Without this internal change facilitated by pressurized qi all these external movement and breath forms at best just relax you, increase flexibility and help normal circulation - which isn’t bad and for sedentary people can be a game changer. They are also useful as preparation for the deeper work, but they are not the deeper work. My understanding is that the goal of sinew changing (channel opening) and marrow washing (changing the brain and heart) and the third (going beyond the mind) is a lot deeper and more profound than stretching and breathing and takes one well beyond normal good healthy functioning. Just as yoga is much more than just asana, the internal arts of East Asia are much more than just Daoyin exercises. I agree, I was sticking to purely physical phenomena as I was under the impression yjj was pure physical conditioning, Do you have any reading at all that suggests otherwise? I personally add other focus points to the practice beyond the physical, I view that as subjective (and at the mercy of the moment and the unceasing wisdom of change) though and as such haven't really posted about it. 2 hours ago, Sahaja said: My understanding is that the true original YJJ and related treatises from the 5th/6th century are not in the public domain if they currently even exist at all. I don’t believe documents prepared hundreds of years later showing them as physical exercises are valid representations of the original YJJ and related works. What we have left of it today are it’s principles that have elements built into certain internal development practices of martial arts and into other internal arts practices. I would love to know what you base this belief on (5th to 6th Century Origins) I'm having a good look around and find little to suggest yjj was n existence then? Is it a hunch that leads you to believe there are 'non public' true original YJJ documents and related Treatise from back then. I'd be fascinated to know. Can I ask what your Key practice has been, and/or do you have any reading material or watching material you could share on this reality of the YJJ? Thankyou. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Sahaja Posted Monday at 11:43 PM 1 hour ago, Thrice Daily said: Are you certain about this Sahaja? Is it more about Static Postures? or is it possible you feel it is easier to achieve the results this way? All the sets I have seen have been moving, do you believe the yjj sets were all adapted from Static Postures and are inferior. yes based on my experience. I think Daoyin exercises go way back in time (at least 300 BC but likely earlier) but the YJJ principles are about using the energy body to change the physical body. Daoyin are more physical based exercises that are useful but do not do what YJJ is intended to do (open the body from the inside out with energy and prepare for deeper work with the “marrow”) 1 hour ago, Thrice Daily said: That makes good sense, 3-5 years, what would you call consistent practice for that 3-5 years, What might a weekly practice rota look like to you? Interested to know your opinion. I agree, I was sticking to purely physical phenomena as I was under the impression yjj was pure physical conditioning, Do you have any reading at all that suggests otherwise? I personally add other focus points to the practice beyond the physical, I view that as subjective (and at the mercy of the moment and the unceasing wisdom of change) though and as such haven't really posted about it. I would love to know what you base this belief on (5th to 6th Century Origins) I'm having a good look around and find little to suggest yjj was n existence then? Is it a hunch that leads you to believe there are 'non public' true original YJJ documents and related Treatise from back then. I'd be fascinated to know. the legend is that YJJ came from Bodhidharma a 5th century Buddhist monk from India who brought the practices to a monastery in China . He taught them to the monks to improve their health and to support them through all the stages of their Buddhist sadhana. My understanding is that after his time warriors/martial artists heard about the internal strength that were a byproduct of the YJJ based practices and came to the monastery to learn and incorporated some of the principles into their training regimes. I think this is how the YJJ became associated with martial arts and mixed with some of these more physical external based exercises. I believe that these physical exercise sets called YJJ were attributed much later to him to benefit from the yjj reputation for developing internal strength. 1 hour ago, Thrice Daily said: Can I ask what your Key practice has been, and/or do you have any reading material or watching material you could share on this reality of the YJJ? Thankyou. Probably two key practices, standing in wuji letting the flesh hang off the bones and sitting anchoring the breath to the lower Dan tian. Both with the mind absorbed inside. While these appear to be static exercises, there is often a great deal of movement going on inside. 1 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Sahaja Posted Tuesday at 06:12 PM If you’ll indulge me I’d like to make one more point that occurred to me when writing on this subject. when talking about sets of exercises in qi gong, we (myself included) often think the specific exercises are the key to the effects/benefits. It seems like a logical approach meaning that if we find the original or correct set of exercises it is just a matter of practice and time (with some cues or feedback). what I have found is more like the opposite - it’s the principles (how we do it) and who we are (qualities in us) that unlock the benefits of the exercises. What this means is that if you have built some extra qi, developed some more internal connectivity and stabilized your internal attention capability a little more, then the benefit/effect of any set of exercises is totally different than without these qualities. This morning I practiced a set called Ding shi from the Cheng Bagua style. I learned this set many years ago but I never really felt much benefit from it or appreciated what it did. I was always much more interested in the flashy application focused ba gua movement forms. Now with a bit more qi, some internal connectivity and some cues on how to approach it, ding shi is a whole new experience including some of its more esoteric aspects that were invisible to me before (e.g.using release to strike/move/turn, the influence of the circle, etc.) It’s gone from why bother to something I enjoy doing every day because the “who” that is practicing it has changed and with that the how to practice it has become clearer. I think this is a message to learn from the YJJ. If you look closely at qi gong, neigong/neidan, bagua, Xing yi, Yiquan, and taiji you can see how they all used the simple principle of bones up/releasing flesh down to build internal skill usually in static postures but also in the moving forms as well (like my ding shi). they may not acknowledge it or sadly sometimes even be aware of it, but it’s clearly there to see if you know what to to look for. so often the practices themselves are marketed as being special and our focus is on the exercises and movements. It drives us to collect sets of exercises like necklaces or baseball cards. Teachers market their sets as special, with special unique energies and even use fear (don’t mix with other systems!) to make them seem even more special. However, what is actually the important thing are the principles (how we do it) and the “who” that is practicing. Once some more of the qualities are in place then you can access the effects of many different exercises/different systems and have some discernment as to which one is applicable to your situation in that moment because you know the how and the who. It also shows you that both the really complex and the really simple forms can carry a similar benefit/effect. Qi gong is a lot more generic than many people think or want to admit. 2 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Thrice Daily Posted Tuesday at 09:24 PM 2 hours ago, Sahaja said: If you’ll indulge me I’d like to make one more point that occurred to me when writing on this subject. when talking about sets of exercises in qi gong, we (myself included) often think the specific exercises are the key to the effects/benefits. See what you mean yes, however the exercises within each set are often going after specific muscle tendons primarily (of course the whole body still involved) essentially we are working on the organs through these specific Muscles tendons and termination points. Helping stretch the deeper fascia around the organ at the other end. Does that sound credible? 2 hours ago, Sahaja said: It seems like a logical approach meaning that if we find the original or correct set of exercises Not so much for me, I’m really happy with the set I do . But… I’m interested to see other sets now (look at similarities and differences etc) I’m interested in the historical side mostly to see if I can gain a better understanding of the particular set I’m doing. Resonate with the origins, or perhaps some of the though arises from the original Chinese-characters that were attributed to the names of the particular exercises within my set… Its a good point you make though, reaching back to the source of any given subject can be a positive endeavour though no, you never know what hidden gems you may uncover there, and in yourself on that journey… 2 hours ago, Sahaja said: it is just a matter of practice and time (with some cues or feedback). Cues and Feedback are needed for me, I’m going to take some lessons again when I can in person. I’ll bet the entire practice will feel completely afterwards 2 hours ago, Sahaja said: what I have found is more like the opposite - it’s the principles (how we do it) and who we are (qualities in us) that unlock the benefits of the exercises. Couldn’t agree more, for example releasing and allowing arms and legs to move at their own speed and momentum of heaviness as opposed to slows and gently flowing (if you see what I mean) dramatically different physical reality and mindset is applied and what emerges is different too. For a number of years I let go of any notion of energy and instead just let the body do the movements. Ironically I got our off my own way in some respects, not all, but some… What kind of ways have you approached practices? And what kind of qualities have you found fitting to extend into your practice with sound benefits and better understanding/knowing? 2 hours ago, Sahaja said: What this means is that if you have built some extra qi, developed some more internal connectivity and stabilized your internal attention capability a little more, then the benefit/effect of any set of exercises is totally different than without these qualities. Sure this just happens naturally though no with anything you do consistency as your skill level and concentration depth and duration increases. I terms of extra energy I do get what you are getting at though. We all have good days and bad days though no? 2 hours ago, Sahaja said: This morning I practiced a set called Ding shi from the Cheng Bagua style. I learned this set many years ago but I never really felt much benefit from it or appreciated what it did. I was always much more interested in the flashy application focused ba gua movement forms. Now with a bit more qi, some internal connectivity and some cues on how to approach it, ding shi is a whole new experience including some of its more esoteric aspects that were invisible to me before (e.g.using release to strike/move/turn, the influence of the circle, etc.) It’s gone from why bother to something I enjoy doing every day because the “who” that is practicing it has changed and with that the how to practice it has become clearer. Sounds fabulous, is this something you find yourself doing spontaneously or do you tend to plan your practice sessions? 2 hours ago, Sahaja said: I think this is a message to learn from the YJJ. If you look closely at qi gong, neigong/neidan, bagua, Xing yi, Yiquan, and taiji you can see how they all used the simple principle of bones up/releasing flesh down to build internal skill usually in static postures but also in the moving forms as well (like my ding shi). they may not acknowledge it or sadly sometimes even be aware of it, but it’s clearly there to see if you know what to to look for. I know what you mean, the more you see it the more you may have chance to experience it and know it for yourself. I lived in Taiwan for a while and got the chance to see many weird and wonderful practitioners, Buddhist monks, Taoist Monks, Massage Therapists, other Healers, Tai Chi people , Martial Artists (just a few though sadly) Mountain Folk some Tribal in east , I gleaned quite a lot, osmosis should never be underrated if you are looking after yourself enough to resonate with others , I was Vegan at the time too, crazy place to be a vegan This is where I got my Yijijing set from, it is a great treasure, I try to look after it well.. 2 hours ago, Sahaja said: so often the practices themselves are marketed as being special Claptrap isn’t it. Money taints Arts if you ask me 2 hours ago, Sahaja said: and our focus is on the exercises and movements. It drives us to collect sets of exercises like necklaces or baseball cards. No not me, not at all. I still with only a few I learned with teachers in person almost exclusively , apart from Bruce Frantzis I haven’t met him yet to thank him for his help along the Way… 2 hours ago, Sahaja said: Teachers market their sets as special, with special unique energies and even use fear (don’t mix with other systems!) Oh come on, you know better than that. Mixing some things is not a good idea especially for beginners. It has taken me years to learn the simple reality in my body that allows alien practices to co exist peacefully and even then I know some things don’t mix so well. example, learning any new system usually is wise to get a strong foundation and practice basics consistently A, this could take a lot of time and energy to get into routine to do enough times to get benefits of foundation to add more B, If you already doing stuff before this it may not play nice with your new system if you carry on C, Would you even have time and energy to do both Thats just for a start… 2 hours ago, Sahaja said: to make them seem even more special. However, what is actually the important thing are the principles (how we do it) and the “who” that is practicing. As vast and varied as the droplets that make up the oceans 🌊 And everyday changing too 💧 Principles remain the same I know, but espteric/alchemical principles, wow that is an infinite realm of possibility from moment to moment 💦 2 hours ago, Sahaja said: Once some more of the qualities are in place then you can access the effects of many different exercises/different systems and have some discernment Wise words, I agree so much comes from letting go and having beginner mind no, then pop , new things pop up. This is the love of qigong you have talking now I think ❤️ 2 hours ago, Sahaja said: as to which one is applicable to your situation in that moment because you know the how and the who. You sound ahead of me here, I’m still learning this. Got a long way to go to fit with cycles, I’m just starting. I’ve got a lot of respect for people who understand how to live in a flow like this. I can freestyle like this, but from year to year I’ve not really deepened my practice yet to really align with the cosmic interplay of cycles, Solar and lunar seasons for example as a start. 2 hours ago, Sahaja said: It also shows you that both the really complex and the really simple forms can carry a similar benefit/effect. Qi gong is a lot more generic than many people think or want to admit. It may be more generic but that being said. Do you have a belief that the teacher or originator of a particular set and transfers or to their students , lives on in the practice somehow and has a deeper and more profound connection to your own experience and resultant knowings? I feel there is some truth in lineage and power too… Almost like specific inter generational wisdom that is locked into families… Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Maddie Posted Tuesday at 09:28 PM I realize I'm a bit late to this conversation but I was watching a video maybe a year ago from Da Mo Mitchel and he said that Yi Jin Jing wasn't a set of exercises but a set of principles. Any thoughts on this? 1 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
ChiDragon Posted Tuesday at 11:20 PM (edited) 1 hour ago, Maddie said: Yi Jin Jing wasn't a set of exercises No, it is a set of exercise. A principle should be expressed in words. Edited Tuesday at 11:21 PM by ChiDragon 1 1 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Maddie Posted Tuesday at 11:22 PM 1 minute ago, ChiDragon said: No, it is a set of exercise. A principle should be expressed in words. Which set is it then? I feel like I see so many different ones. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
ChiDragon Posted 19 hours ago 7 hours ago, Maddie said: Which set is it then? I feel like I see so many different ones. All of them are exercises. Just don't pay too much attention to the names. It is just like Taiji. There are many different names, but they accomplish the same purpose and produce the same effects on the human body. 1 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Thrice Daily Posted 18 hours ago Totally agree with you, but then the two are inseparable , principle yes being expressed with words (maybe coming from a thought and place with no obvious physical movement) and the physical set (the multitude of strategy one can express the principle through) That lovely old adage I often refer to. “Be consistent in principle and flexible in strategy” but this is where it gets interesting. Apply Wu Wei to the formula and what do you get? So do the movements in a state of none action and do you still get the Results of the Yijinjing that seem so very specific as laid out in a sense through describing the roots of the Chinese characters _ Principles Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
-ꦥꦏ꧀ ꦱꦠꦿꦶꦪꦺꦴ- Posted 17 hours ago (edited) 11 hours ago, Maddie said: I realize I'm a bit late to this conversation but I was watching a video maybe a year ago from Da Mo Mitchel and he said that Yi Jin Jing wasn't a set of exercises but a set of principles. Any thoughts on this? It’s a set of exercises based on a set of principles 9 hours ago, ChiDragon said: No, it is a set of exercise. A principle should be expressed in words. Correct 9 hours ago, Maddie said: Which set is it then? I feel like I see so many different ones. Search up the old threads for Gengmenpai Yijinjing and you will find something legit Edited 17 hours ago by -ꦥꦏ꧀ ꦱꦠꦿꦶꦪꦺꦴ- 1 2 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
