Text Analysis: The AbraMelin

[Daniel]

Hello,

 

This thread will be analyzing and discussing the AbraMelin, as it is written, using both the French and German translations.  My intention is to complete the entire book in bi-weekly installments.  The text will be provided.  All are invited to participate, regardless of knowledge, background.  I would like this thread to be a place to share.  Like a book-club, or, a reading group.  Each participant, naturally, will read the text thru the prism of their own culture, beliefs, and experiences.  I would like to foster an environment, here, in this thread, which appreciates contrasting views as complimentary.  Yes, I will hold myself to these same ideals.    In brief, the more, the merrier.  Welcome.

 

Archive.org – French Translation:
https://archive.org/details/bookofsacredmagi00abra

 

Archive.org – German Translation:
https://archive.org/details/abraham-von-worms-georg-dehn-steven-guth-lon-mbook-fiorg

 

If any are having trouble accessing the above translations, please send me a message.  I’ll be extracting the text from the pdfs for each installment to facilitate copying, pasting, and discussing the material.

 

---

 

About the AbraMelin French translation, Amazon writes:

 

This remarkable grimoire was translated by S.L.M. Mathers from a 15th century French mauscript. This text has had a huge influence on modern ceremonial magic, and has been cited as a primary influence on Aleister Crowley. Abraham of Würzburg, a cabalist and scholar of magic, describes a quest for the secret teachings which culminated in Egypt, where he encountered the magician Abramelin, who taught him his system in detail. The procedure involves many months of purification, followed by the invocation of good and evil spirits to accomplish some very worldly goals, including acquisition of treasure and love, travel through the air and under water, and raising armies out of thin air. It also tells of raising the dead, transforming ones appearance, becoming invisible, and starting storms. The key to this is a set of remarkable magic squares, sigils consisting of mystical words which in most cases can be read in several directions. Of course, these diagrams are said to have no potency unless used in the appropriate ritual context by an initiate. Mathers analyzed these words in an extensive set of notes and gives possible derivations from Hebrew, Greek and other languages.

 

---

 

About the AbraMelin German translation, Amazon writes:

 

It is the first modern translation of this critical magical work since S.L. Macgregor Mathers's original translation over 100 years ago. Not only is the language updated, but Georg Dehn, the compiler and editor, has sourced his work from all extant manuscripts, whereas Mathers used just one. The result is a stunning new translation, which has already set the occult world abuzz.

 

[Nungali]

What a great resource !   Yes, 'certain things ' will become clear as we go along ;

 

Let me know when you get to the part about the wand in the German translation ( the version you previously said we need to look at )  which you claimed was a  merely a  Yad  ;  a pointer to read the Torah

 

Here  is a 'heads up '  on that  :

 

p 118  " the consecrated wand  '  ( you Denied these things needed to be consecrated . )

 

p80 describes this consecration .

 

- on this note I am wondering if you have ever had any magical practical experience ?   Consecrations are done with the 'Holy Oil ';  ideas and recipes for this have always been a key part in ritual magick . How could one then deny consecrations of magical tools? They must have known nothing about these essential parts of the preliminary set up  which includes , of course, making the consecrating oil first .

 

Would you like the recipe ?

 

p77 " Almond tree wood ,  smooth and straight , from the length of about half an el to six feet "   *   Yads are smaller, have a pointed hand or finger on the end and usually made of silver ... are they not ?

 

p 102 ; "show them the consecrated wand "

 

p134  " Holding the wand , conjure ... "    are spirits conjured with a Torah pointer ? 

 

p144  put the sigil on the head of the (being ) and strike it with the wand and things will be restored .

 

Do you do that with a Torah pointer ?

 

See page 87 where it is compared to the  staff of Aron, Moses, etc .  Which was adopted from Egypt .  That is, as I said before  'a magic wand or staff '  in the hermetic magic tradition which is based on Egyptian wands or staffs .

 

 

Egyptian Snake Staff

 

 

Another heads up ;

 

This is a  'holy devotional'  ritual to put you in communion with God  after a time of purification and sanctity ,  the one giving out the ritual extracted an oath of  living in the ways of the lord .

 

... now, look at the aim of the talisman squares  !  the results, the powers one supposedly gets from the talismans one is able to make after doing the ritual ;   " To be able to see a naked maiden  ? To walk under water as long as you want , to find gold money treasures !   "the invocation of good and evil spirits to accomplish some very worldly goals, including acquisition of treasure and love, travel through the air and under water, and raising armies out of thin air. It also tells of raising the dead, transforming ones appearance, becoming invisible, and starting storms."    and the rest ....  Seriously ?   It reads more like the  Arabian myths that got into the Hebrew Bible with Solomon .

 

But I will wait and see what your objective is here first  ..

If , as before, you are going to try and claim it is a Jewish ritual based on a Torah pointer and the crown is a  teffilin ...

 

( which in Abramelin is  described as a crown or mitre  ..  and a woven fillet of   silver and gold  on p. 76  *

 

mitre ;

 

 

if anything it was based on a Byzantine Bishop's crown .  The teflin is nothing like it   ... and so on , you are going to have to address this disparity between method and result in this ritual .

 

 

* the only Hebrew association is via  'kaitar '  ( p. 119 )   קטר -  crown or summit , to make to rise up in summit ' ,  a demon , - I think in this case we can simply go with 'crown' .

 

Personally , I have no desire to do all that to see a naked maiden .... I live on a hippy commune  - I just go down to the river .  Also, I can affirm that any ritual done to get gold, riches and money are the hardest to get results from !   ( You are better off going directly for the things you would use that money for  ( eg , a stash of wood to build a new extension , the actual car instead of money to buy one  ) ... but why am I telling you this !?  I am sure you dont do magic to get those things .... do you ?

- so what IS your aim here Daniel ?  Do you want to take up ritual magick now ?

[Daniel]

3 hours ago, Nungali said:

so what IS your aim here Daniel ? 

 

What is my "aim", Nungali?  To start a book club, more or less.  It'll be fun. Everyone's invited.

 

Edited November 8 by Daniel

[Daniel]

3 hours ago, Nungali said:

Let me know when you get to the part about the wand in the German translation

 

Sure.

 

3 hours ago, Nungali said:

you Denied these things needed to be consecrated . )

 

p80 describes this consecration .

 

Cool.  If I'm wrong, I'm happy to be corrected.

 

[Daniel]

3 hours ago, Nungali said:

Personally , I have no desire to do all that to see a naked maiden ...

 

 

Your loss

[Daniel]

14 hours ago, Nungali said:

the only Hebrew association is via  'kaitar '  ( p. 119 )

 

Page 119.  Got it.

 

14 hours ago, Nungali said:

קטר -  crown or summit

 

קטר is not a crown or summit.   קטר is the verbal root of ketores, the Hebrew word for "incense".  Exodus 30:34-35

 

https://www.sefaria.org/Klein_Dictionary%2C_קטר_ᴵ.1?lang=bi

 

---

 

Exodus 30:35

 

 

And you shall make it into incense, "קטרת" a compound according to the art of the perfumer, well blended, pure, holy.

 

 

 

Edited November 8 by Daniel

[Daniel]

16 hours ago, Nungali said:

 

* the only Hebrew association is via  'kaitar '  ( p. 119 )   קטר -  crown or summit , to make to rise up in summit ' ,  a demon , - I think in this case we can simply go with 'crown' .

 

The word for crown, in this context, is Keter ( pronounced Keser ).  It's easy to confuse, because even-though they are spelled differently; phonetically, they're identical..

 

Keter is familar, for many, because it is the 1st of the sephirot.  Spelling it properly is important, because, the iconography resonates with the meaning, the "energy", for lack of better words.
 

16 hours ago, Nungali said:

  קטר -  crown or summit , to make to rise up in summit ' ,  a demon

 

ק, Kuf, the first letter, doesn't fit for a crown, because, energetically, kuf "bounces up and down like a monkey".  This "up/down" is present in the iconography, and executed by the scribe when they are putting quill to parchment.  In the word Ketores, the Kuf conveys the simultaneous upward smoke and downward ash.  This doesn't fit for "crowning" or ascending a summit.

 

https://www.chabad.org/library/article_cdo/aid/137091/jewish/Kuf.htm

 

 

 

Edited November 8 by Daniel

[Daniel]

12 hours ago, Nungali said:

קטר -  crown or summit , to make to rise up in summit ' ,  a demon ,

 

The most common word for demon is שד, "Shaid".

 

Here is a link to a list.  The closest is קטב.  A pestilence.    קטר is not a demon.  However, there is a story in the talmud where someone raised smoke from incense to a demon.  It's in the list.  

 

https://www.sefaria.org/search?q=demon&tab=text&tpathFilters=Reference%2FDictionary%2FJastrow|Reference%2FDictionary%2FKlein Dictionary&tvar=1&tsort=relevance&svar=1&ssort=relevance

 

 

13 hours ago, Nungali said:

'kaitar '

 

Keetair,  to rise smoke ( burn incense ) to a demon.  It is not a demon itself.  

 

 

 

 

 

[Daniel]

13 hours ago, Nungali said:

  'kaitar '  ( p. 119 )

 

119.  Thank you.

 

 

13 hours ago, Nungali said:

קטר -  crown or summit , to make to rise up in summit ' ,  a demon

 

The transliteration is wrong.

 

13 hours ago, Nungali said:

  קטר

 

The transliteration on page 119 is KThR.  כתר

 

Keser - Crown.

 

Formally, kuf is transliterated as 'Q', and 'Th' is a tav lacking a dagesh.

 

Edited November 8 by Daniel

[Daniel]

14 hours ago, Nungali said:

( p. 119 )   קטר 

 

First, thank you for pointing this out.  The Mather's translation botched the transliteration of the demon's name.  

 

14 hours ago, Nungali said:

crown or summit , to make to rise up in summit ' ,  a demon

 

Because of Mather's mistake ( or the editors ) a false correspondence has been made.  Readers don't know Hebrew so they don't notice the mistake.  The editors must not have known Hebrew so they don't notice it either.

 

קיטר = a type of demon

כתר = crown
ִ

 כתר =/= ק'טר

demon =/= crown

 

14 hours ago, Nungali said:

what IS your aim here Daniel ?

 

...here?

 

I have knowledge which is needed for properly understanding this book.  Without being able to read Hebrew, the reader will not know that Page 119 is transliterated wrong.  If those names are important to a reader, they will not be getting accurate information without someone like me reading the book with them.   I think readers will appreciate what I can bring to this discussion.

 

This is one small example of what could be a whole host of translation and transliteration errors in the Mathers translation. 

 

Thank you.

 

Edited November 8 by Daniel

[Daniel]

2 hours ago, Daniel said:

I think readers will appreciate what I can bring to this discussion.

 

16 hours ago, Nungali said:

the only Hebrew association is via  'kaitar '  ( p. 119 )   קטר -  crown or summit , to make to rise up in summit ' ,  a demon ,

 

Vocally:  it is pronounced kee-yuh-tair  Emphasis on the first syllable. KֶֶֶֶֶEE-y'tair.

Written:  Don't forget the 'yud'.  קיטר

 

Correspondence:  grinding of incense ; rising smoke and falling ash

 

Edited November 8 by Daniel

[Nungali]

19 hours ago, Daniel said:

 

Sure.

 

 

Cool.  If I'm wrong, I'm happy to be corrected.

 

 

Then see post 2 where you have been corrected .

[Nungali]

19 hours ago, Daniel said:

 

 

Your loss

 

 There we have it !

 

A Holy ritual and devotion unto God , with an aim to see a naked maiden . Your response is  ' my loss' .

 

Okay then ,

[Nungali]

10 hours ago, Daniel said:

 

Page 119.  Got it.

 

 

קטר is not a crown or summit.   קטר is the verbal root of ketores, the Hebrew word for "incense".  Exodus 30:34-35

 

https://www.sefaria.org/Klein_Dictionary%2C_קטר_ᴵ.1?lang=bi

 

 

Crown and or summit is ALSO a meaning Daniel .  

 

The word in its relation ship to incense is via context .   It works the same in many languages

 

Eg Japanes 'shomen' can mean top, head,  the shrine in the east ... etc . 

 

Now, answer me this ;  IF  it ONLY means incense and not head as well , how do we make sense of the text ? By thinking oit  meant 'put burning incense on your head ?  Instead of put a crown on your head ?

AND that information came from the  German text you are using as the reference .

 

if we go on your one interpretation of the word  ( regardless of how much and how big the Hebrew text you post here ) it doent make any sense either with the text or anything you claimed before about it .

 

Seriously Daniel ? 

 

 

I included  the other meanings  , it appears you are not aware of the words variations . it can also mean, by extension ,  to rise up , the summit or top  of .

 

From the document you put here as the reference .

 

It probably does have the rise up meaning when used in reference to offering and incense  as in the quote you made  BUT here it referring to something you put at the top ... the crown . Its there in black and white to see !

 

.

Edited Friday at 10:33 PM by Nungali

[Nungali]

10 hours ago, Daniel said:

 

The word for crown, in this context, is Keter ( pronounced Keser ).  It's easy to confuse, because even-though they are spelled differently; phonetically, they're identical..

 

Keter is familar, for many, because it is the 1st of the sephirot.  Spelling it properly is important, because, the iconography resonates with the meaning, the "energy", for lack of better words.
 

 

ק, Kuf, the first letter, doesn't fit for a crown, because, energetically, kuf "bounces up and down like a monkey".  This "up/down" is present in the iconography, and executed by the scribe when they are putting quill to parchment.  In the word Ketores, the Kuf conveys the simultaneous upward smoke and downward ash.  This doesn't fit for "crowning" or ascending a summit.

 

https://www.chabad.org/library/article_cdo/aid/137091/jewish/Kuf.htm

 

 

 

 

 

Jiggledy pigglely

 

I am going on what the text YOU prescribed said as the reference here .

[Nungali]

9 hours ago, Daniel said:

 

119.  Thank you.

 

 

 

The transliteration is wrong.

 

 

The transliteration on page 119 is KThR.  כתר

 

Keser - Crown.

 

Formally, kuf is transliterated as 'Q', and 'Th' is a tav lacking a dagesh.

 

 

 

So now you have put up a version you want to use  but you are going to correct it as you see fit as you admit it is wrong in places .

 

Again/ please explain why one would want to put a burning box of incense on their head , when it says a crown in the translation

and more to the point 

 

 This was  and  is all a Daniel diversion yet again to cover the fact you originally said it was a teflin .

 

So this thread looks like a dud to me .

[Nungali]

9 hours ago, Daniel said:

 

First, thank you for pointing this out.  The Mather's translation botched the transliteration of the demon's name.  

 

 

Because of Mather's mistake ( or the editors ) a false correspondence has been made.  Readers don't know Hebrew so they don't notice the mistake.  The editors must not have known Hebrew so they don't notice it either.

 

קיטר = a type of demon

כתר = crown
ִ

 כתר =/= ק'טר

demon =/= crown

 

 

...here?

 

I have knowledge which is needed for properly understanding this book.  Without being able to read Hebrew, the reader will not know that Page 119 is transliterated wrong.  If those names are important to a reader, they will not be getting accurate information without someone like me reading the book with them.   I think readers will appreciate what I can bring to this discussion.

 

This is one small example of what could be a whole host of translation and transliteration errors in the Mathers translation. 

 

Thank you.

 

 

 

So?

 

Your correction is going to be when anyone might want to try and follow  the ritual ; is to put a burning box iof incense on their head

 

or a teflin on their head ?

 

which is it ?

[Nungali]

8 hours ago, Daniel said:

 

 

Vocally:  it is pronounced kee-yuh-tair  Emphasis on the first syllable. KֶֶֶֶֶEE-y'tair.

Written:  Don't forget the 'yud'.  קיטר

 

Correspondence:  grinding of incense ; rising smoke and falling ash

 

 

and place THAT on your head ?

 

me thinks this is more of a case  of 'pants on fire'  than hair on fire !

 

 

[Nungali]

and if you want to do what you are attempting top do here  then you would not be needing to go of this German translation but the Hebrew one .

 

 So how does a book written in German  get wrongly translated into English , because of some obscure points of Hebrew grammar ?

 

" The book exists in the form of twelve manuscripts and an early printed edition. The provenance of the text has not been definitively identified. The earliest manuscripts are two versions that date from about 1608, are written in German "

 

 

[Daniel]

On 11/8/2024 at 2:13 PM, Nungali said:

Crown and or summit is ALSO a meaning Daniel . 

 

I'm not going to argue.  We have both given our opinion.  Readers can decide.

 

On 11/7/2024 at 3:09 PM, Nungali said:

קטר -  crown or summit

 

^^ your opinion ^^

 

On 11/8/2024 at 3:42 AM, Daniel said:

https://www.sefaria.org/Klein_Dictionary%2C_קטר_ᴵ.1?lang=bi

 

A Hebrew/English dictionary.

 

"קטר -  crown or summit" is not in the dictionary.  Scroll up and down to see for yourself.

 

[Daniel]

On 11/8/2024 at 2:13 PM, Nungali said:

IF  it ONLY means incense and not head as well , how do we make sense of the text ?

 

Let's discuss it in context.

[Jadespear]

On 11/7/2024 at 7:24 AM, Daniel said:

Hello,

 

This thread will be analyzing and discussing the AbraMelin, as it is written, using both the French and German translations.  My intention is to complete the entire book in bi-weekly installments.  The text will be provided.  All are invited to participate, regardless of knowledge, background.  I would like this thread to be a place to share.  Like a book-club, or, a reading group.  Each participant, naturally, will read the text thru the prism of their own culture, beliefs, and experiences.  I would like to foster an environment, here, in this thread, which appreciates contrasting views as complimentary.  Yes, I will hold myself to these same ideals.    In brief, the more, the merrier.  Welcome.

 

Archive.org – French Translation:
https://archive.org/details/bookofsacredmagi00abra

 

Archive.org – German Translation:
https://archive.org/details/abraham-von-worms-georg-dehn-steven-guth-lon-mbook-fiorg

 

If any are having trouble accessing the above translations, please send me a message.  I’ll be extracting the text from the pdfs for each installment to facilitate copying, pasting, and discussing the material.

 

 

---

 

About the AbraMelin French translation, Amazon writes:

 

This remarkable grimoire was translated by S.L.M. Mathers from a 15th century French mauscript. This text has had a huge influence on modern ceremonial magic, and has been cited as a primary influence on Aleister Crowley. Abraham of Würzburg, a cabalist and scholar of magic, describes a quest for the secret teachings which culminated in Egypt, where he encountered the magician Abramelin, who taught him his system in detail. The procedure involves many months of purification, followed by the invocation of good and evil spirits to accomplish some very worldly goals, including acquisition of treasure and love, travel through the air and under water, and raising armies out of thin air. It also tells of raising the dead, transforming ones appearance, becoming invisible, and starting storms. The key to this is a set of remarkable magic squares, sigils consisting of mystical words which in most cases can be read in several directions. Of course, these diagrams are said to have no potency unless used in the appropriate ritual context by an initiate. Mathers analyzed these words in an extensive set of notes and gives possible derivations from Hebrew, Greek and other languages.

 

 

---

 

About the AbraMelin German translation, Amazon writes:

 

It is the first modern translation of this critical magical work since S.L. Macgregor Mathers's original translation over 100 years ago. Not only is the language updated, but Georg Dehn, the compiler and editor, has sourced his work from all extant manuscripts, whereas Mathers used just one. The result is a stunning new translation, which has already set the occult world abuzz.

 

 

 

 

.... ARE YOU AWARE - that working with the princes of hell is not a good idea?  You have no idea what you're doing with this.  Stay away from this at all costs.  

 

"Occult abilities are just flowers of the Tao, and the beginning of all foolishness.  The master rests in the root, not in the flower.  Relies on what he can use, not on the superficial". 

 

True spirituality has nothing to do with sorcery involving outside agents.  Actual cultivators do not rely on anything but themselves to accomplish anything.  Working with the known names of the actual devil is deplorable.  Wisen up bro.  That which is true does not need deception.  All this is, is the work of deception.  

[Daniel]

On 11/8/2024 at 2:20 PM, Nungali said:

now you have put up a version you want to use

 

I am using the Mather's translation 3rd edition.  There is a link on page 1, 1st post.

 

Spoiler

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

[Daniel]

29 minutes ago, Jadespear said:

ARE YOU AWARE - that working with the princes of hell is not a good idea?

 

Thank you for your heart-felt concern. Yes.  I am aware.  I am not, in any way, working with "the princes of hell".  The book is written; I'm seeing questions and comments about it on multiple forums.  Good people.  Seeking communion and knowledge from a guardian angel ( which some refer to as their higher selves ).  

 

If this text is dangerous, it is my opinion, the right thing to do is: open up the book, read it, and discuss it openly and honestly.   The text is already public and popular ( in certain circles ).  There's no benefit avoiding it.

 

Edited Monday at 12:37 AM by Daniel

[Nungali]

10 hours ago, Daniel said:

 

Thank you for your heart-felt concern. Yes.  I am aware.  I am not, in any way, working with "the princes of hell".  The book is written; I'm seeing questions and comments about it on multiple forums.  Good people.  Seeking communion and knowledge from a guardian angel ( which some refer to as their higher selves ).  

 

 

Except it includes a process to make demonic talisman , does it not ?

 

 

10 hours ago, Daniel said:

 

If this text is dangerous, it is my opinion, the right thing to do is: open up the book, read it, and discuss it openly and honestly.   The text is already public and popular ( in certain circles ).  There's no benefit avoiding it.

 

 

But there might be  UN BENEFIT  when it s in the wrong hands and for the wrong purpose , especially when misunderstood , used for 'unusual' purposes, or by the inexperienced .

 

Have you studied or practised ritual magic Daniel ?