Transmission Outside of Scripture

[Mark Foote]

A friend of mine was kind enough as to offer criticism of my latest post (on my own site). She said:
 

I found it very meandering.

 

Cut to the quick, she's good with swords!  

I responded:

 

I view what I’m doing as more like a mathematical proof. My favorite proofs, and I believe those of my instructors, are the ones where the result just falls out from seemingly unrelated or seemingly unimportant related work.

I thought the most interesting part of this post was the characterization of transmission outside of scripture as the transmission through demonstration of activity of the body solely by virtue of the free location of consciousness. That being the characteristic of the fourth concentration, and while it’s true there are a number of sermons where Gautama arrived at “profound knowledge” (enlightenment) while in the fourth concentration, it’s also true (by the “seven persons existing in the world” sermon) that attainment of the fourth concentration alone does not automatically result in the complete destruction of the cankers.

 

Folks wonder why their authentic Zen master has been sleeping around, they think enlightenment should preclude this. From the time of Gautama, the answer has been no, that’s not necessarily the case. What is transmitted in the Zen tradition does not in and of itself mean that sensory desire is cut off at the root.

Something I didn’t delve into in the essay, because I didn’t need to in order to make the points I wanted to make, is the record of how Gautama arrived at “profound knowledge” in the fourth concentration.  He did so by using the pliability of his mind in that state to reflect on “former habitations”, and “the passing and arising of beings”, after which he attained insight into the four truths about suffering and a similar four truths about the cankers.  That’s how the cankers were “cut off at the root” for him. I dare say, if I were witnessing my habitations in past lives, and my own past and future lives as well as those of the people around me, the cankers might come to be completely destroyed in me as well!  But I don’t expect that.

And as I point out in the essay, I can aspire to live the way of life of Gautama that was a thing “perfect in itself, and a pleasant way of living besides” without enlightenment. You can too, if you catch a glimpse of the “base of consciousness”, the mind, moving as you’re dropping off to sleep.  It’s nothing to be afraid of, you know.

 

In fact, helps me fall asleep, all the time!

 

 

The post is here, love to have all  the sword-masters here weigh in...
 

 

 

Edited January 19 by Mark Foote

[Mark Foote]

I neglected to mention something, with regard to activity of the body solely by virtue of the free location of consciousness (the characteristic of the fourth concentration).  

When such activity is witnessed, there's a falling away of "latent conceits that I am the doer, mine is the doer, with regard to this consciousness-informed body" (MN 109, Pali Text Society vol III p 68). What remains is something like this:

 

When (one's) mind is thus concentrated, pure and bright, unblemished, free from defects, malleable, wieldy, steady and attained to imperturbability, (one) directs and inclines it to knowledge and vision. (One) understands thus: ‘This is my body, having material form, composed of the four primary elements, originating from father and mother, built up out of rice and gruel, impermanent, subject to rubbing and pressing, to dissolution and dispersion. And this is my consciousness, supported by it and bound up with it.’

Great king, suppose there were a beautiful beryl gem of purest water, eight-faceted, well cut, clear, limpid, flawless, endowed with all excellent qualities. And through it there would run a blue, yellow, red, white, or brown thread. A (person) with keen sight, taking it in (their) hand, would reflect upon it thus: ‘This is a beautiful beryl gem of purest water, eight faceted, well cut, clear, limpid, flawless, endowed with all excellent qualities. And running through it there is this blue, yellow, red, white, or brown thread.’ In the same way, great king, when (a person's) mind is thus concentrated, pure and bright … (that person then) directs and inclines it to knowledge and vision and understands thus: ‘This is my body, having material form, composed of the four primary elements, originating from father and mother, built up out of rice and gruel, impermanent, subject to rubbing and pressing, to dissolution and dispersion. and this is my consciousness, supported by it and bound up with it.’

 

(DN 2 Sāmaññaphala Sutta, tr. Bhikkyu Bodhi)
 

 

Consciousness tied to the body like a jewel on a string.  Activity of the body by virtue of the free location of consciousness, in particular the activity of inhalation and exhalation by virtue of the free location of consciousness, allows the recognition that the free location of consciousness is nevertheless tied to the body.

That's at the heart of the "knowledge and vision" that Gautama saw as a desirable outcome of the religious life.

Of course, even Robert Munroe saw that as the case, in his "Far Journeys".  He learned that in order to come back into his body (after he had travelled out of it, to god knows where), all he had to do was to make himself aware of his breathing. Didn't seem to give Robert the "intuitive wisdom" that is synonymous with the destruction of the cravings that Gautama saw as obstacles to the religious life (“craving for the life of sense”, “craving for becoming”, and “craving for not-becoming” [DN 22; PTS vol. ii p 340]--when the cankers are “destroyed”, the roots of the craving for sense-pleasures, the roots of the craving “to continue, to survive, to be” [tr. “bhava”, Bhikkyu Sujato], and the roots of the craving not “to be” [the craving for the ignorance of being] are destroyed).
 

That insight, that consciousness is bound to the body, is also likely the source of statements of Gautama like this:

 

It were better… if the untaught manyfolk approached this body, child of the four great elements, as the self rather than the mind. Why so? Seen is it… how this body, child of the four great elements, persists for a year, persists for two years, persists for three, four, five, ten, twenty, thirty years, persists for forty, for fifty years, persists for a hundred years and even longer. But this… that we call thought, that we call mind, that we call consciousness, that arises as one thing, ceases as another, whether by night or by day.
 

(Pali Text Society SN vol. II p 66)

 

A more humble view of the mind and consciousness, acquired through maintaining a presence of mind with the location of consciousness, the location of the "heart-mind", until activity of the body is solely by virtue of the location of that consciousness (until habit and volition in the activity of the body have ceased). And realizing that the location of consciousness is by necessity, necessity in the movement of breath, necessity in the structure of the sacrum and spine, necessity that arrives from beyond the boundaries of the senses but is nevertheless tied to them. The location of consciousness, bound to the necessity of the body.

Yes, talking to myself, forgive me...

 

 

Edited February 18 by Mark Foote

[Lairg]

On 1/20/2025 at 9:11 AM, Mark Foote said:

transmission through demonstration of activity of the body solely by virtue of the free location of consciousness

 

There is a proposition that consciousness requires a material vehicle (e.g. brain) so that consciousness is an interaction of spirit and matter.

 

What happens when the spirit is not attached to a physical vehicle?   

 

Perhaps that is the state of awareness - not restricted by the need for a nearby physical body

 

I have often become conscious of a sound/sensation that was already in the back of my  awareness for quite a while.

 

 

 

 

[silent thunder]

On 2/17/2025 at 4:51 PM, Lairg said:

 

There is a proposition that consciousness requires a material vehicle (e.g. brain) so that consciousness is an interaction of spirit and matter.

 

What happens when the spirit is not attached to a physical vehicle?   

 

Perhaps that is the state of awareness - not restricted by the need for a nearby physical body

 

I have often become conscious of a sound/sensation that was already in the back of my  awareness for quite a while.

Bodies manifest within the field of awareness.  Awareness does not manifest within a physical form.  Physical form is one small, dense aspect of awareness.  Rest as awareness.

[Lairg]

3 hours ago, silent thunder said:

Awareness does not manifest within a physical form.

 

On 2/18/2025 at 10:51 AM, Lairg said:

Perhaps that is the state of awareness - not restricted by the need for a nearby physical body

 

It seems we are somewhat in agreement.

 

I wonder whether awareness is unified in the cosmos.   Or can an individual have its own awareness?

 

What is the means of propagation of awareness?

 

 

[Mark Foote]

On 2/17/2025 at 4:51 PM, Lairg said:

 

There is a proposition that consciousness requires a material vehicle (e.g. brain) so that consciousness is an interaction of spirit and matter.

 

What happens when the spirit is not attached to a physical vehicle?   

 

Perhaps that is the state of awareness - not restricted by the need for a nearby physical body

 

I have often become conscious of a sound/sensation that was already in the back of my  awareness for quite a while.

 

 

 

I think it's complicated.

 

In his “Genjo Koan”, Dogen wrote:

 

When you find your place where you are, practice occurs, actualizing the fundamental point. 

 

(Genjo Koan [Actualizing the Fundamental Point]”, tr. Robert Aitken and Kazuaki Tanahashi, from “Moon in a Dewdrop: Writings of Zen Master Dogen”, p 69)

 

 

My explanation:  given a presence of mind that can “hold consciousness by itself”, activity in the body begins to coordinate by virtue of the sense of place associated with consciousness.  A relationship between the free location of consciousness and activity in the body comes forward, and as that relationship comes forward, “practice occurs”.  Through such practice, the placement of consciousness is manifested in the activity of the body.

 

Dogen continued:
 

When you find your way at this moment, practice occurs, actualizing the fundamental point…

 

(ibid)

 

My explanation:  “when you find your way at this moment”, activity takes place solely by virtue of the free location of consciousness. A relationship between the freedom of consciousness and the automatic activity of the body comes forward, and as that relationship comes forward, practice occurs. Through such practice, the placement of consciousness is manifested as the activity of the body.

 

(Take the Backward Step)

 

 

Dogen didn't stop there:

 

Although actualized immediately, the inconceivable may not be apparent.

(ibid)

 

Kobun Chino Otogawa gave a practical example of that, even though he wasn’t talking about “Genjo Koan” at the time:
 

You know, sometimes zazen gets up and walks around.

(Kobun Chino Otogawa, my recollection of a lecture at S. F. Zen Center in the 1980’s)

 

Activity of the body solely by virtue of the free location of consciousness can sometimes get up and walk around, without any thought to do so.

 

Action like that resembles action that takes place through hypnotic suggestion, but unlike action by hypnotic suggestion, action by virtue of the free location of consciousness can turn out to be timely after the fact.  When action turns out to accord with future events in an uncanny way, the source of that action may well be described as “the inconceivable”.
 

I have found that zazen is more likely to “get up and walk around” when the free location of consciousness is accompanied by an extension of friendliness and compassion, an extension beyond the boundaries of the senses. Gautama the Buddha described such an extension:
 

[One] dwells, having suffused the first quarter [of the world] with friendliness, likewise the second, likewise the third, likewise the fourth; just so above, below, across; [one] dwells having suffused the whole world everywhere, in every way, with a mind of friendliness that is far-reaching, wide-spread, immeasurable, without enmity, without malevolence. [One] dwells having suffused the first quarter with a mind of compassion… with a mind of sympathetic joy… with a mind of equanimity that is far-reaching, wide-spread, immeasurable, without enmity, without malevolence.

(MN 7; translation Pali Text Society vol. I p 48)

 

Gautama said that “the excellence of the heart’s release” through the extension of the mind of compassion was the first of the further concentrations, a concentration he called “the infinity of ether” (SN 46.54; © Pali Text Society Vol V p 100-102).
 

The Oxford English Dictionary offers some quotes about “ether” (Oxford English Dictionary, s.v. “ether (n.),” March 2024):

 

They [sc. the Brahmins] thought the stars moved, and the planets they called fishes, because they moved in the ether, as fishes do in water.
 

(Vince, Complete System. Astronomy vol. II. 253 [1799])

 

Plato considered that the stars, chiefly formed of fire, move through the ether, a particularly pure form of air.
 

(Popular Astronomy vol. 24 364 [1916])

 

When the free location of consciousness is accompanied by an extension of the mind of compassion, there can be a feeling that the necessity of breath is connected to things that lie outside the boundaries of the senses.  That, to me, is an experience of “the infinity of ether”.

(The Inconceivable Nature of the Wind)
 

Maybe you're hearing the cosmic wind!

 

 

[Lairg]

 

It is commonplace that dreams usually need to be recorded immediately upon waking as the memory fades very quickly.

 

It may be that while asleep we are usually out of the body, thus operating with the mind but without the brain connection.

 

If the concept of parallel universes/timelines is considered, the brain is largely restricted to this 3D timeline, but the mind may be on several streams at once

 

 

[stirling]

With deference Mark, I feel like you are seeking something with this continued line of questioning. What IS it? Did you have an experience that you can't reconcile and are trying to understand? Are you trying to construct a theory for something you haven't experienced? Do you feel like there is some "hidden" Buddhism that others have missed out on, best explained on some cludge of Zen and Theravada doctrines? What do you REALLY want to know? I ask this with what I hope you see as great compassion for your continued quest.

[stirling]

As far as real transmission outside of scripture, it happens all the time... Sufis, Hindus, Jains, and even Christians and Jews, amongst a multitude of even those with no formal belief system can come to realization.

[Mark Foote]

On 2/20/2025 at 6:55 PM, Lairg said:

 

It is commonplace that dreams usually need to be recorded immediately upon waking as the memory fades very quickly.

 

It may be that while asleep we are usually out of the body, thus operating with the mind but without the brain connection.

 

If the concept of parallel universes/timelines is considered, the brain is largely restricted to this 3D timeline, but the mind may be on several streams at once

 

Are you familiar with Olaf Blanke's work?  He's one of the authors of this experiment:
 

 

The gentleman in the video describes an experiment where they actually induced an out-of-body experience in subjects who volunteered for the experiment.

One conclusion Blanke has drawn from his study of out-of-body experiences in the medical literature is that natural out-of-body experiences may be the result of damage or impairment in the connections of certain senses associated with balance, principally occuloception, proprioception, equalibrioception, and graviception. The eyes especially have a tight connection with the sense of the location of the consciousness associated with the self, as demonstrated in the full-body illusion in the video.  

 

Perhaps it's possible to alter the coordination of those senses and induce an out-of-body experience without damage to any sense organs.  That may have been what Robert Monroe did when he induced his own out-of-body experiences, as recorded in "Far Journeys".

 

Edited March 8 by Mark Foote

[Mark Foote]

On 2/21/2025 at 12:03 AM, stirling said:

As far as real transmission outside of scripture, it happens all the time... Sufis, Hindus, Jains, and even Christians and Jews, amongst a multitude of even those with no formal belief system can come to realization.
 

I think the experience of the sixth patriarch of Zen was unusual, in that he was said to have turned a corner by virtue of hearing a line from the Diamond Sutra recited by an itinerant priest in the marketplace:

 

Let the mind be present without an abode.
 

(from the Diamond Sutra, translation by Venerable Master Hsing Yun from “The Rabbit’s Horn: A Commentary on the Platform Sutra”, Buddha’s Light Publishing pg 60)
 

 

Lots of stories in the Zen tradition of people being enlightened by a shout or a blow, or by other actions of a master. Some stories of people being enlightened through the presence of a master, without any particular action. Not so many stories of people being enlightened by words as straightforward as those the sixth patriarch heard.

If the transmission does not entail words, is not by means of scripture, is not by virtue of understanding, then how does transmission take place?  That is what I am addressing in the post I link to in the OP:
 

... activity solely by virtue of the free location of consciousness, the hallmark of the fourth concentration, has been conveyed by demonstration in some branches of Buddhism for millennia.
 

Activity solely by virtue of the free location of consciousness can be demonstrated as action, can be demonstrated as inaction, can be picked up without any words through a kind of a physical intuition. And teachers like Yuanwu's disciple Dahui Zonggao apparently believed that was the only way the teaching could actually be transmitted--he's the one who tried to burn the printing blocks of "The Blue Cliff Record".  And yet the sixth patriarch seems to have picked it up through a fortuitous meeting of personal experience and the spoken word.

Learn something every day, says here that "Yuanwu gave Huqiu Shaolong an enlightenment certificate that is the oldest surviving document written by a Chan master."  (https://emuseum.nich.go.jp/detail?langId=en&webView=&content_base_id=100223&content_part_id=0&content_pict_id=0)

 

"Available now, for a limited time only!"--"Big Mind" certification. What we've come to, I guess.

 

Edited March 8 by Mark Foote

[Lairg]

1 hour ago, Mark Foote said:

If the transmission does not entail words, is not by means of scripture, is not by virtue of understanding, then how does transmission take place? 

 

I find it useful to consider the physical plane (and body) as an effect rather than a cause.

 

A well known version is the Qabalistic Tree of Life that fits nicely on the human body - mapping the (potential?) connection of 10 intelligences to the physical form.

 

Each of these intelligences may have sufficient access to the human physicality to provide energies and understandings that can be absorbed by the brain and nervous system.

 

I often see progressed humans that have available to them greater understanding and skills.   The incoming awareness patterns appear as energy fields that, when tested for suitable quality and intent, can be unfolded and absorbed by the human with immediate results.

 

Prior testing is critical as not all offered energy fields are beneficial.  

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Edited March 9 by Lairg

[Lairg]

1 hour ago, Mark Foote said:

Are you familiar with Olaf Blanke's work?  He's one of the authors of this experiment:

 

I watched the video.  I prefer a high-dimensional view of humanness.  The human is not an accidental outcome

 

 

[stirling]

20 hours ago, Mark Foote said:

Lots of stories in the Zen tradition of people being enlightened by a shout or a blow, or by other actions of a master. Some stories of people being enlightened through the presence of a master, without any particular action. Not so many stories of people being enlightened by words as straightforward as those the sixth patriarch heard.

If the transmission does not entail words, is not by means of scripture, is not by virtue of understanding, then how does transmission take place?

 

I don't honestly think it is the shout, blow, or pebble hitting the jar, a word of scripture, or anything else that is the impetus, but the moment of stillness that happens afterward. In Zen, the reason for keisaku (stick) on the shoulder is to surprise the mind into stillness. The same is true of most "crazy wisdom" stories, like that told to me by Roshi Ian Forsberg about Kobun getting up in the middle of dokusan and jumping out the window. 

 

Really, no-one and no-thing can "transmit" enlightenment. It isn't a contact high. It is the stillness of the mind that makes us "accident prone" which is why Soto advocates for the practice of shikantaza, where resting the mind in stillness is really no different from enlightenment itself. Where there is enlightenment there IS no-self to experience it, and no other to bequeath it. It is simply a shift in perspective, away from identification as an "I" and into identification with the field of experience, or "awareness". 

[Lairg]

2 hours ago, stirling said:

I don't honestly think it is the shout, blow, or pebble hitting the jar, a word of scripture, or anything else that is the impetus,

 

There are accounts of the assemblage point.  Apparently when a human is ready to change consciousness an intentional blow to the assemblage point can trigger the change

 

https://consciousreminder.com/2016/12/18/assemblage-point-seat-consciousness/

 

https://thefourwinds.com/moving-assemblage-point/

 

 

[Mark Foote]

On 3/9/2025 at 3:30 PM, Lairg said:

 

There are accounts of the assemblage point.  Apparently when a human is ready to change consciousness an intentional blow to the assemblage point can trigger the change

 

https://consciousreminder.com/2016/12/18/assemblage-point-seat-consciousness/

 

https://thefourwinds.com/moving-assemblage-point/

 

 

 

 

Interesting point of view.  Here's another account of moving consciousness:

 

… as an experiment, I recommend trying it, sitting in this posture (legs crossed in seated meditation) and trying to feel what it’s like to let your mind, to let the base of your consciousness, move away from your head. One thing you’ll find, or that I have found, at least, is that you can’t will it to happen, because you’re willing it from your head. To the extent that you can do it, it’s an act of letting go–and a fascinating one.

(“No Struggle [Zazen Yojinki, Part 6]”, by Koun Franz, from the “Nyoho Zen” site, parenthetical added)

 

I'm writing a piece I hope to post before too long, that continues in the same vein:

 

Franz mentioned that “the base of consciousness” might relocate to the center of gravity. Most modern references to the lower dan-t’ian situate it somewhere below and behind the navel, at the approximate center of gravity of the body.

Franz spoke about “letting go” to allow the “base of consciousness” to move away from the head. Gautama spoke about “making self-surrender the object of thought” in order to “lay hold of one-pointedness”, and enter the first concentration:

 

Herein… the (noble) disciple, making self-surrender the object of (their) thought, lays hold of concentration, lays hold of one-pointedness. (The disciple), aloof from sensuality, aloof from evil conditions, enters on the first trance, which is accompanied by thought directed and sustained, which is born of solitude, easeful and zestful, and abides therein.

 

(SN 48.10, Pali Text Society vol. V p 174)

“Self-surrender” is the abandonment of any exercise of will. Gautama spoke of how the exercise of will could lead to “a station of consciousness”:

That which we will…, and that which we intend to do and that wherewithal we are occupied:–this becomes an object for the persistance of consciousness. The object being there, there comes to be a station of consciousness….

 

But if we neither will, nor intend to do, nor are occupied about something, there is no becoming of an object for the persistance of consciousness. The object being absent, there comes to be no station of consciousness.

(SN 12.38; tr. Pali Text Society SN vol. II p 45)

The exercise of will can station the location of consciousness, and an “act of letting go”, “making self-surrender the object of thought”, can free it.

I would say that the “thought directed and sustained” of the first concentration comes out of necessity, as a presence of mind with “the base of consciousness” is maintained from inhalation to exhalation and from exhalation to inhalation. If a presence of mind is maintained, the natural tendency toward the free location of consciousness draws out “thought directed and sustained”.

... The zest and ease that Gautama referred to I believe are the zest and ease born of activity of the body by virtue of the free location of consciousness. A relaxed presence of mind with the “specific position in space” of “the base of consciousness” can bring such activity and such feelings to light, and the feelings can then be extended such that “there is not one particle of the body that is not pervaded” by them.
 

 

A different take, but an assumption similar to that of your second link, that the "seat" of consciousness can move away from the head.

 

 

 

 

 

 

[Mark Foote]

On 3/9/2025 at 1:03 PM, stirling said:

and no other to bequeath it. 
 

That would be why Yuanwu gave Huqiu Shaolong an enlightenment certificate?

 

 

[stirling]

46 minutes ago, Mark Foote said:

That would be why Yuanwu gave Huqiu Shaolong an enlightenment certificate?

 

Maybe it's sort of like this:

 

 

 

 

I read on your link that the certificate washed up in a box on a shore someplace in Japan. Perhaps it wasn't considered very valuable?

 

-

 

We get the Soto Lineage documents, for what it's worth:

 

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Zen_lineage_charts#Soto_school

[Lairg]

3 hours ago, Mark Foote said:

A different take, but an assumption similar to that of your second link, that the "seat" of consciousness can move away from the head.

 

The first format of mediation I was taught,  when augmented by "advanced techniques", was a mantra that made a sequence of sounds that progressed from the chakra immediately above the head, to the upper head chakra, throat, upper heart, lower heart and finally upper solar plexus.

 

The sequence harmonized each of the relevant chakras and was sufficient to move my awareness into a timeless zone.  "Goodness, is that the time already?"

 

That  was superseded by other techniques that just appeared while I was meditating

 

 

  

Edited March 15 by Lairg

[old3bob]

 

cut the silver cord and one may locate at who knows where and also with no way back. 

[Mark Foote]

On 3/14/2025 at 5:59 PM, stirling said:

 

Maybe it's sort of like this:

 

 

 

 

I read on your link that the certificate washed up in a box on a shore someplace in Japan. Perhaps it wasn't considered very valuable?

 

-

 

We get the Soto Lineage documents, for what it's worth:

 

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Zen_lineage_charts#Soto_school
 

Wonder if Baker ever signed off on Reb.  Not that Reb needed signing off on!

The Denkoroku lists successors, but as I recall there is one point in the chain where the chain was actually broken. The author of Denkoroku gestured mystically, and all was well! 

Maybe that's the spot in the lineage chart on Wikipedia that's a Rinzai master.

Washed up in a box!  Will wonders never cease.

 

 

[stirling]

10 hours ago, Mark Foote said:

Wonder if Baker ever signed off on Reb.  Not that Reb needed signing off on!

 

I dunno, those chaps were before my time. Certainly Reb knew what he was talking about, his book "Being Upright" is a master class in seeing from Wisdom. 

 

10 hours ago, Mark Foote said:

The Denkoroku lists successors, but as I recall there is one point in the chain where the chain was actually broken. The author of Denkoroku gestured mystically, and all was well! 

Maybe that's the spot in the lineage chart on Wikipedia that's a Rinzai master.

 

Exceptionalism is over-rated. When the whole field of experience is ALREADY enlightened and always has been, how could it possibly matter what a list says?

[Lairg]

4 hours ago, stirling said:

When the whole field of experience is ALREADY enlightened and always has been, how could it possibly matter what a list says?

 

Perhaps enlightenment is just the entry fee to the real work

 

 

[stirling]

3 hours ago, Lairg said:

Perhaps enlightenment is just the entry fee to the real work

 

There is no change in the basic understanding after enlightenment, only a seemingly endless deepening, the dropping of subtler and subtler dualities.

[Lairg]

If you say so...