Kunlun & Wang Liping

[ToL]

Can anyone say what are the differences between Max's practice, and Wang Liping's practice?

Are those practices at the same level, or Wang Liping's practices takes a stronger effect?

Maybe they reach the same goals but Kunlun is the quick quick path?

I heard about people studying Longmen Pai but not with Wang Liping, or any of his students. Are those different teachings? maybe there are others you can learn from other then Wang Liping...

Anyway, what practice is more powerful?

[Wun Yuen Gong]

I would say that most people close to him (wang li ping) wouldnt even know how much information he truely knows! Imagine his level ???

 

I see WLP as a spiritual practice and Kunlun as a energy adjustment or readjustment practice so i cant compare to be honest, sorry!

 

Basically i say Wangs is based on stillness and emptiness or void and Max's KL as a movement type energy!!

[ToL]

Maybe anyone in here had an experience with both practices and can compare and share his experiences?

Mantra, Can you share your opinion with your knowledge and from what you have learned from Max?

Joeblast, I read that you practice both practices, can you share some experiences and differences between the two?

Edited August 1, 2008 by ToL

[freeform]

With Kunlun you become a 'conductor' - with most other systems you become a 'capacitor'... I've only read about Wang Li Ping and his practices, but it seems he goes the capacitor route - storing, building, cultivating energy. Kunlun clears, opens, flows the energy.

 

The capacitor type practices mirror agriculture - you sow the seeds, you tend to your crop, cultivate, harvest then store, refine etc.

 

The conductor type practices mirror pre-agricultural, tribal, shamanistic hunter gatherer societies. With these practices you invoke the spirits of animals, gods, the universe to flow through you. The challenge here is to allow more and more power to flow through by clearing any obstructions and resistances and surrendering all control.

 

This is, of course, a complete over-simplification, but it's the general idea... The capacitor system is more 'modern' - the conductor more ancient...

 

The difficulty of the capacitor system is that you need to work very hard, need to be very consistent, very exact, controlled, you can't make mistakes because you will lose what you've built and stored...

 

The difficulty of the conductor system is pretty much the opposite - you have to let go of all control, which sounds simple, but can be very frighting - you have to let go of all that you think that you are, and in our society which is based on complete control of everything this is very difficult indeed...

 

And again - this is over-simplifying into black and white something that really isn't that black and white - but it gives you a general idea of the difference in the paths.

[ToL]

great post freeform, thank you for your answer.

I think the Longmen pai is preety ancient too, and has shamanistic aspects in it, that's why Wang Liping is called a "wizard", is this correct?

[The inner Light]

With Kunlun you become a 'conductor' - with most other systems you become a 'capacitor'... I've only read about Wang Li Ping and his practices, but it seems he goes the capacitor route - storing, building, cultivating energy. Kunlun clears, opens, flows the energy.

 

The capacitor type practices mirror agriculture - you sow the seeds, you tend to your crop, cultivate, harvest then store, refine etc.

 

The conductor type practices mirror pre-agricultural, tribal, shamanistic hunter gatherer societies. With these practices you invoke the spirits of animals, gods, the universe to flow through you. The challenge here is to allow more and more power to flow through by clearing any obstructions and resistances and surrendering all control.

 

This is, of course, a complete over-simplification, but it's the general idea... The capacitor system is more 'modern' - the conductor more ancient...

 

The difficulty of the capacitor system is that you need to work very hard, need to be very consistent, very exact, controlled, you can't make mistakes because you will lose what you've built and stored...

 

The difficulty of the conductor system is pretty much the opposite - you have to let go of all control, which sounds simple, but can be very frighting - you have to let go of all that you think that you are, and in our society which is based on complete control of everything this is very difficult indeed...

 

And again - this is over-simplifying into black and white something that really isn't that black and white - but it gives you a general idea of the difference in the paths.

 

freeform,

 

your post rocks! just wanted to let you know what you wrote was awsome! so clearly put i would never been able to do so.

 

thanks a lot!

 

touched,

 

the inner light.

[freeform]

thanks a lot!

 

touched,

 

the inner light.

 

 

great post freeform, thank you for your answer.

I think the Longmen pai is preety ancient too, and has shamanistic aspects in it, that's why Wang Liping is called a "wizard", is this correct?

 

I'm sure there are ancient shamanistic aspects in Liping's system. Most systems have it to some degree - the five animal movements, for example, are shamanistic - you embody the spirit of the animal and let it's power run through you.

 

There is, however, a constant underlying theme of collecting, refining cultivating by direct will and intention.

 

in 'conductor' arts you may well do these things, but you're never directly guiding or controlling it - it just happens - you may hear practitioners of these arts say things "the energy moves me" - rather than 'I move the energy'.

 

In capacitor arts you may tap the energy of the spirit, but it then serves a purpose in the rest of the cultivation. You collect and guide it to fulfil a purpose.

 

both these paths actually converge at the higher levels... it just depends what your heart leads you to.

[ToL]

I find myself smiling second time at the end of your posts

XSZ is what Wang Liping teaches? or does he teach something else?

Maybe learning and combining both ways the "capacitor" and the "conductor" is good?

BTW, I think Kunlun Level 2 is about moving the energy consciously.

[Yoda]

Freeform,

 

that's a way cool way off looking at it!!!!

 

thanks!

Yoda

[freeform]

Freeform,

 

that's a way cool way off looking at it!!!!

 

thanks!

Yoda

 

 

Wasn't AugustLeo an electrical engineer? he might have some cool additions to the capacitor/conductor analogy... I also thought of someone sleepwalking through life as a resistor - not much gets in, nothing gets stored, not much released...

 

I find myself smiling second time at the end of your posts smile.gif

XSZ is what Wang Liping teaches? or does he teach something else?

Maybe learning and combining both ways the "capacitor" and the "conductor" is good?

BTW, I think Kunlun Level 2 is about moving the energy consciously.

 

 

I'm sorry, I don't really know what Liping teaches - I only know of his Dragon Gate school...

 

Combining, I believe, wouldn't work - I mean a capacitor conducts to a certain degree, but if you're going the conductor route you'll have such a huge voltage working through you that starting to control the process (resist the flow) could blow the whole circuit!

 

Similarly as a capacitor, if you conduct too much, you could lose all that you've stored!

 

In K2 we don't really direct the energy - to me it feels like (once there is enough free-flow) you 'pressurise' the energy - (add voltage(?) - here's where my lack of knowledge in electric circuits shows) - the pressure then opens up more room for more current to flow through, the energy moves by itself, we don't direct.

[SiliconValley]

Freeform,

 

that's a way cool way off looking at it!!!!

 

thanks!

Yoda

 

Or one way of looking at it. Mind is a great trickster. We always look at things the way we want to, to suit our beliefs, our convenience. It may not always be safe to rely on the mind and the various theories it dishes out, completely. Never mind that!

 

- Also, are we suggesting it was "difficult" for Wang Liping or his great masters to "Let Go" and hence he had to practice whatever he did?

- If both practices ultimately yield the same results, certainly the simpler one would be the preferred one, unless one is "unable" to "let go". Great masters have always tried to simplify their teachings to the world to the best possible extent. Is Sifu Wang's system meant to address only those who cannot "let go".

 

There certainly seems to be much more to his system than that..is this comparison even fair or valid? Kunlun is a technique and even Max/Mantra do not seem to advertise this as a complete, all-in-all system. Sifu Wang's is a system and it is quite possible Kunlun [with some other name] is one of the many techniques taught therein.

Edited August 1, 2008 by SiliconValley

[sheng zhen]

Combining, I believe, wouldn't work - I mean a capacitor conducts to a certain degree, but if you're going the conductor route you'll have such a huge voltage working through you that starting to control the process (resist the flow) could blow the whole circuit!

 

Similarly as a capacitor, if you conduct too much, you could lose all that you've stored!

It might not work to combine a capasitor and a conductor, but you must not forget that this is just an analogy. Not real life.

 

I believe it absolutely is possible to combine. When you consciousness is lucid and free, your whole existence a tool, where you can jump back and forth through all kinds of states, maby even stay lucid in many different states at the same time, then there should be no problem with combining conductor- and capacitor practices.

 

Sifu Wang's is a system and it is quite possible Kunlun [with some other name] is one of the many techniques taught therein.

Actually, in the blog the blogger explained how people got spontaneous reactions like laughing, crying, shaking and stuff like that when LiPing worked on them.

[findley]

-so if I am mixing 'conducting' and 'capictor' methods, then I am... really only going in circles with my practice?

 

Is there a way to discern all the practices that belong to each respective 'type' of cultivation?

 

.. Are you sure that some practices aren't compatible with both types? (wouldn't emptiness meditation be an example..?)

[WhiteTiger]

XSZ is what Wang Liping teaches? or does he teach something else?

 

I'm sorry I'm not familiarize with the abbreviation of XSZ.

I've heard of Wang Liping giving lectures and teaching Nei Dan, (a complete practice) and I'm sure other practices.

 

Maybe learning and combining both ways the "capacitor" and the "conductor" is good?

I'm not sure about that one. The explanation of capacitor and conductor was an example of the function (in general) of separate practices.

 

BTW, I think Kunlun Level 2 is about moving the energy consciously.

 

Have you practiced level 1 Kunlun? Have you completed level 1 Kunlun? Have you practice level 2 Kunlun?

[joeblast]

XSZ is Xing Shen Zhuang - an opening standing practice that works on the spine & hips.

 

kunlun level 2 is not about consciously moving energy

 

Silicon...lei shen dao is just a path like any other and has its own intricacies. the kunlun form that max teaches is not a part of what liping teaches (not that I'm an absolute authority nor do I know the full extent of what he teaches.) I was told that kunlun is not compatible with the foundation training path.

 

freeform...sounds like you're having just a little confusion with voltage vs amplitude since the 'vibe' is always the same, I'd say the voltage is a constant, we just up the amperage with more practices like k2.

[Cameron]

Intersting question.

 

Should you do a Max workshop or a Wang Liping retreat?

 

While Freeform's description is interesting it's not really based on experience with Wang Liping. The issue here is that there is alot of feedback here on Max and Kunlun(mostly positive, don't pay attention to the people who say negative things about Max they mostly all haven't met Max or done Kunlun)and little feedback on Wang Liping.

 

Considering this could potentially be one of the most important decisions of your life I would say do as much research as you can. Read all the posts on Taobums about Kunlun, read the new Kunlun book, if your on the west coast Max is doing more workshops next month and he does a free lecture the night before his workshops. You can vibe him out for yourself and ask questions first.

 

Read Opening Dragon Gate if you haven't already. There are atleast a couple students of Wang Liping on Taobums, maybe pm them or read everything they have written. I am guessing the David Shen Foundation board has info on Wang Liping. It costs money to join but it will probably give you more details and info on the practices then here.

 

Good luck

[joeblast]

you'll probably learn more about liping from the dragon gate book than the forum. practices arent detailed there, but there are practice discussions...if you want to learn that stuff, you have to learn it in person.

[Cameron]

Oh, ok.

 

Well, read the book then.

 

Maybe also pray to heaven on which path to take or something

[SiliconValley]

The kunlun form that max teaches is not a part of what liping teaches (not that I'm an absolute authority nor do I know the full extent of what he teaches.) I was told that kunlun is not compatible with the foundation training path.

 

 

This is what Max said, right? So that's his version.

 

But do we know if Sifu Wang does not teach the same or similar practice, or something that does the same as Kunlun, even if it was not called specifically as "Kunlun"? What I was trying to say is that Kunlun is a technique in Max's system. Comparison should be between two systems and not between a technique [or sub-system] and a system.

[ToL]

Maybe also pray to heaven on which path to take or something

 

 

I was told that kunlun is not compatible with the foundation training path.

 

Too bad, I love kunlun, but I am also interested in the teachings of Wang Liping.

So you stoped practicing the foundation practices? (Can you share your experience with them comparing to Kunlun?)

 

Cameron, wow thanks for your warm answer.

Currently I am not able to come to a Kunlun seminar, I am waiting for the next Europe tour. I know there is a chance to go to Wang Liping's Seminar this November, I hope he will have more Seminars in Europe in the future..

 

Can you say that in both ways you are independent from the teacher after the Transmission?

[Cameron]

For me, Max's transmission was very powerful but it was the first and only transmission I had. I did more workshops with him and the energy I experienced was very high.

 

Max said you only need to see him once, but I think seeing him multiple times was beneficial. Basically he says you do one workshop with him and your all set.

 

My guess is Max will go to Europe again. If you end up being more drawn to Max then Wang Liping you could practice from the book until he comes and would have a really good foundation for when you get the transmission. For me the energy after I met Max was very intense and not grounded. So if I was going to recommend the best way to do it to someone I would say practice I Jong, Mao Shan standing and maybe a little Kunlun for awhile even before you met Max. Which would be the case since it would be awhile until he returns to Europe anyway.

 

But if you decide to go to the Wang Liping retreat best of luck. I am guessing that would be an incredible experience if you can do it.

[Wun Yuen Gong]

I dont know about all you but i wouldnt compare Wang to Max! Wang is such a higher level and his system is much more in depth and has many levels. Its not a mix match of different practices the way Max has combined his. Wangs is one pure lineage plus im sure Wang Li Ping has been through alot more then Max even though i havent met them both but going from the post of Mantra and the rest of the Kunlun followers AND the dragon gate book based on Wang Li Ping you can see some of the information and hardships he went through.

[AugustLeo]

.

[Mantra68]

I dont know about all you but i wouldnt compare Wang to Max! Wang is such a higher level and his system is much more in depth and has many levels.

WYG, please tell me what level Max is at.

 

Has he surpassed his teachers?

 

Do you know what level they were/are at?

 

Please explain your system of analysis.

 

As I have said, he has shown only a very small amount of what he can actually do. He has only taught a few of the hundreds of practices he knows and he has only shown a few of the thousands of variations of those practices.

 

When you meet him, you may be surprised to find that he is a master technician and more than capable at refining a system or practice for maximum effect.

[Cameron]

What would be really cool if Chris or someone would write a book about Max's life someday like they did Liping. Believe me, from the little bit I know about Max it would be atleast as entertaining as "Opening the Dragon Gate".