Rant about tao mountain

[GrandTrinity]

I was just thinking how the Healing Tao is an elitist school. They claim to be so spiritual, but tell me this: are the real spiritual people living is resorts? Are the spiritual people charging money for us to use their swimming pools and suanas and gourmet food? Are they living with ethics? I dont know.

 

I think a lot of taoists would through up when they see how other taoists in America (richest country in the world) are living in such luxury. I know real yogis would!

 

Im sorry but how can you be spiritual and be rich at the same time? You better balance it or your going to hell!

 

Your saposed to live in a cave and then when your enlightened, come down and spread heaven on earth! You shouldnt have to charge people for your teachings because they should be given to the poor, the people who need and deserve it. And if someone wants to donate you money because you deserve and need it, then thats what should keep a healer going materialy, from the hearts of the people they help, not from their fat checkbooks.

 

Tao mountain is a 5 star resort pretty much, and that is weird. Seriosuly, they should also have campsites at least, for people to camp out under the stars and learn the tao while remaining in the elements, rather than spraying water up their ass with the bedays.

 

I want to go to tao mountain this summer, but I may just end up camping out somewhere in Walker Valley or a nearby town, if anyone would like to join me or knows a good campsite, then lets do it.

[sunshine]

I very much know your thoughts... in certain ways I think similar, but honestly: wouldn't anybody charge only a few select would be able to learn it. It's been that way in the past. Was it any better?

 

My father always said: If you deslike something do it better!!!

 

So man. Learn everything you can and offer it for free if you can. I will definitely learn from you then...

 

 

Harry

[el_tortugo]

I was just thinking how the Healing Tao is an elitist school. They claim to be so spiritual, but tell me this: are the real spiritual people living is resorts? Are the spiritual people charging money for us to use their swimming pools and suanas and gourmet food? Are they living with ethics? I dont know.

 

I think a lot of taoists would through up when they see how other taoists in America (richest country in the world) are living in such luxury. I know real yogis would!

 

Im sorry but how can you be spiritual and be rich at the same time? You better balance it or your going to hell!

 

Your saposed to live in a cave and then when your enlightened, come down and spread heaven on earth! You shouldnt have to charge people for your teachings because they should be given to the poor, the people who need and deserve it. And if someone wants to donate you money because you deserve and need it, then thats what should keep a healer going materialy, from the hearts of the people they help, not from their fat checkbooks.

 

Tao mountain is a 5 star resort pretty much, and that is weird. Seriosuly, they should also have campsites at least, for people to camp out under the stars and learn the tao while remaining in the elements, rather than spraying water up their ass with the bedays.

 

I want to go to tao mountain this summer, but I may just end up camping out somewhere in Walker Valley or a nearby town, if anyone would like to join me or knows a good campsite, then lets do it.

5079[/snapback]

 

 

sounds pretty funny...do they wipe your ass with taoist toilet paper?..... silky smooooth

[Lozen]

I have really mixed feelings about the whole money thing...

 

I think selling a good product is GOOD! You are giving people the opportunity to purchase it. And that's how I look at the stuff I sell and getting right with money--I am offering people the opportunity to get an awesome product that they wouldn't be able to get before.

 

So yeah I think you can be spiritual and have money. Just like you can be broke and not have money. How you treat other people is the important part, the rest is just detail.

[GrandTrinity]

"Im sorry but how can you be spiritual and be rich at the same time? You better balance it or your going to hell!"

 

That is the point of what I am saying. If you make a living in the spiritual arena, you better balance that with the non material. The chi become the material and the material becomes the chi. Its a delicate balance. If you are such a great healer people should flock to you and give you money to support yourself even when you decline to take their money. Thats the point. Spiritual people have to denounce the desire to aquire others wealth, or else they are slaves to the $ just like everyone else. This is a huge aspect of yogic ethics; to purify your mind and body you must mediate on this daily, as a Hindu.

 

But instead Michael Winn sits on his beday and sprays water in his ass all summer...well thats an exageration, but seriously, what was it like at Big Indian before they moved to the resort? I hear they had a lot better community and it makes sense, as everyone is A LOT more humble when they dont have bedays and suanas, and are living in nature like real taoists, not some fucking royalty. Not that taoists are not the true royalty but you know what Im saying. It all balanced in the end.

[el_tortugo]

 

 

 

 

Your saposed to live in a cave and then when your enlightened, come down and spread heaven on earth! You shouldnt have to charge people for your teachings because they should be given to the poor, the people who need and deserve it. And if someone wants to donate you money because you deserve and need it, then thats what should keep a healer going materialy, from the hearts of the people they help, not from their fat checkbooks.

 

 

5079[/snapback]

 

 

these bums are all around you.... keep an eye and an ear out for the real deal near you!

 

i just had one sitting with me quizing me before he got chased off by the management.... just before i wrote this reply.

 

you will notice while they talk to you or show you something that you get a very heightened awareness of your surroundings and everything slows down like doing a long meditative form...

[peter falk]

i've been to tao mountain and i think your impression of it is not correct. in fact, i was indigent at the time and michael set up a work-study for me so i could afford it. i also made friends with the resort owner, corky jeronimo, a real down-to-earth guy, and quite funny.

 

i think the environment is set up more for the students than for michael. retreats for tao mountain are cheaper than tracker school, and the lodgings and food are far better, though by no means luxurious. i stayed in two different rooms and neither one had a beday. also, one guy camped out that week. don't know how he set it up ahead of time.

 

in ancient china inthe day of hermits, masters typically passed on what they knew to one or two studnets, that's it. the reason so many of us are able to learn qigong nowadays in the West is because people charge money for it. the world is a different lace nowadays and we live in a different culture. michael actually charges less than a lot of chinese people here in china.

 

two stories about china, both about guys who are taoist priests and qigong adepts. the first guy wanted to charge me 200 US DOLLARS PER HOUR to teach me chinese medicine. the second guy lied about the room prices at a monastery on qingcheng shan and charged us DOULBE THE PRICE in order to pocket the difference himself.

so there ya go.

 

 

being spiritual and being rich are not mutually exclusive, but being spiritual and being crooked or greedy are. wealth does not come from greed, even though it often does. it could just come from hard work and sound financial planning. b ut that's a another story. i've known lots of rich spiritual people.

[farooq]

"being spiritual and being rich are not mutually exclusive, but being spiritual and being crooked or greedy are. wealth does not come from greed, even though it often does. it could just come from hard work and sound financial planning. "

 

very well said

[neimad]

speaking about resorts and luxury,

 

i attended one of mantak chia's seminars in thailand.

 

they put up this thing of their place is oh so luxury... and it is.... except, i don't know why, but our room every single night the smell of faeces (shit) wafted in the window. every night we could smell shit in our room.

 

it seemed all a bit of a scam to me actually and i didn't manage to take anything of value cos mantak chia was so damn confusing and all over the place doing nothing in any kind of logical sequence.

 

i no longer have anything to do with the healing tao, i had to remove all their 'hooks' from me because they were tying me down and slowly destroying my relationship with my girflriend.

 

they offer such a huge variety of techniques that to practice them all you would have no time left for anything else.... one for this and one for that. i mean it's not really all that complex, you don't need so many formulas. and they hook you with all the claims about what each one will do for you, make you stronger, cleanse your bones, your organs, rejuvenate your thymus gland, etc.

i got so concerned with trying to make myself healthy that i began to be unhealthy through this junk!

 

what i am doing now is way better and way more simple and enjoyable too.

 

in my opinion, forget winn and chia. i have no judgement for what they are doing, they can do whatever they like... but i don't think it's worth being involved in them because if you look critically at them and their students it is borderline cultish.

[Lozen]

See the thing is if you give shit away people don't take it seriously or put any value in it. I used to give herbs away to anybody who would take them, and then i realized I had two problems. 1) people weren't using the s hit i gave them and 2) i was always broke...

 

Anybody who thinks that money is not important has never had to live without it.

[sunshine]

Anybody who thinks that money is not important has never had to live without it.

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See. We might never agree at world politics

 

but here we are:

 

what you say is soooooooooooooooooooooo true

 

Harry

[Mitch]

[GrandTrinity]

it all balances in the end... there were bedays in the two rooms I stayed at there...true they offer some work studies which is good...qigong is expensive these days here and in China, I mean, thats just the way it is. Rare do you see someone teaching for free. But check out www.taoisthealing.com

[neimad]

Anybody who thinks that money is not important has never had to live without it.

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money is as important as you make it.

 

it's just another flow of energy, one you can tap into just like the chi and extract, should you desire.

abundance is a choice, it is a matter of perspective on how you view the world.

right now we all have millions of dollars flying through us... money has become electronic now and is sent around as signals. we are all millionares.

 

choose to be abundant, and you will be.

money is important but it is also irrelevant.

 

the people who make lots of money, are the people who choose to.

the people who live in poverty, are the people who choose to.

 

it may not seem obvious with starving people around and poor people and poverty everywhere and who am i to say coming from a middle class family where i never had to deal or struggle with poverty?

but that's just the point.... i chose this. i chose not to live in poverty and i continue to choose this.

 

being rich and miserable is better than being poor and miserable isn't it?

hahahahahaaha.

 

money used to concern me. money used to be something i hated and wanted at the same time.

now it is something i am indifferent to, something i spend because i have lots of it... even when i don't, i still do. and i have never been richer than now, not in $ values... but in flow of money. it's just an energy. let it flow through you, tap into the flow and the flow will happen.

there is heaps of money floating around there, heaps and heaps and heaps... just gotta stick out that hand and let it fall into it.

 

spend like you have lots of money, and you will have lots of money.

 

the trick to money is having some.

 

hahahahahahaahahahahaahahahahahahahaha.

[Lozen]

Again I say that anybody who thinks that money is not important, or can be indifferent towards it, has never had to live without it.

[neimad]

Again I say that anybody who thinks that money is not important, or can be indifferent towards it, has never had to live without it.

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no, and i will never have to live without it either... cos i CHOOSE not to.

[sunshine]

no, and i will never have to live without it either... cos i CHOOSE not to.

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Tell me something. I know that there are a lot of people out there that believe it is a question of what you choose to. And that if you are open to money it will simply come to you, being drwand to you by whichever universal principle...

 

BUT:

 

look. you are a student. You have to get your studies done and pay for your bills. You have to work... the possible jobs out there do not pay more than what is possible in the society at that moment in time...

 

now. Do you say that if I am open enough and choose not to have too little money the lottery will just make me a happy camper, or that an old woman simply know I lack money and will give me hers???

 

I think in order for the possibility to choose to have more some conditions for having the chance to choose to have to be met first...

 

and this requires some serious work and the proper timing. Money does not come from nowhere and just sitting around.

 

Harry

[TwoTrees]

I've always noticed that when I am doing a job making supple amounts of money...it's almost ALWAYS a job that I either cannot stand doing or one that involves borderline immoralities to consider.

 

It's a tricky thing. Lately I'm not broke, but I do however tend to be shortchanged at times...I just have to control some impulses better...and just stick to business.

 

Business without practice, though...NO WAY.

 

That shit keeps me sane.

[neimad]

Tell me something. I know that there are a lot of people out there that believe it is a question of what you choose to. And that if you are open to money it will simply come to you, being drwand to you by whichever universal principle...

 

BUT:

 

look. you are a student. You have to get your studies done and pay for your bills. You have to work... the possible jobs out there do not pay more than what is possible in the society at that moment in time...

 

now. Do you say that if I am open enough and choose not to have too little money the lottery will just make me a happy camper, or that an old woman simply know I lack money and will give me hers???

 

I think in order for the possibility to choose to have more some conditions for having the chance to choose to have to be met first...

 

and this requires some serious work and the proper timing. Money does not come from nowhere and just sitting around.

 

Harry

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i was a student.... the government paid me for no real reason all the while during my studies... just some glitch or something with our system.

 

i have at time began to get short of money, needed a job... and wonderful one will just literally appear to me at the right time. this has happened so many times that i no longer think of it as strange, or coincidence.

 

if you are really really open to winning the lottery, then sure it's highly possible and likely that will happen. but the truth is you probably will not be able to open yourself up to it because you will be thinking that winning that money is not hard earned enough, you don't really deserve it, and so on.

if you are open and receptive to finding money, or money coming to you, then it will.

 

however being open to the energies of money does not neglect hard work etc. finding money will likely only be a small part of an income, bank errors etc that can occurr will happen if you are receptive to them. money can find you, i know it.

 

even just about finding the right kind of job. or making the choice to set up that internet business, or whatever, and having it work because you project your energy into it or open yourself up to it succeeding.

 

the truth is the possibilities are always limitless, with regards to everything, not just money.

 

something i have realised is that wealth cannot be accurately gauged in a quantity, rather it is a flowing number... something along the lines of, wealth = money earned/found/etc + money spent

 

i will have to think about this formula a bit more. i know i put a + in there which appears as if your wealth is actually twice as much as what you really have.... but it's kinda like that. money, until it is spent, is meaningless! absolutely damn meaningless! unless you are doing something with it.... it is not worth anything!

so your wealth is your flow of money.

 

in other words, i am a millionare.... not because i have millions of dollars, but because it is likely that during my life a million dollars or more will flow through me...

 

get it?

 

hahaha crazy i know, but oh so cool.

 

the universe is infinite potential and infinite possibility.

[GrandTrinity]

Stick your fingers, gently, all the way into your hara. Then to the 5 elemtns around it. Put your hand over your hara and lay back and mediate. Then you are rich because you are in your center. All money has to flow through your center. So in theory, if you keep doing this, you should be able to put mad money through your center. Do it? I know I will!

 

money=psychic energy

 

what is there infinite of?

 

be a billion air

 

money becomes chi and chi becomes money

 

what is chi?

 

what is between heaven and earth, of course

 

If this is truely the fruit of your cultivation, you will be a billionaire spiritualy and physicaly.

[neimad]

thinking about the formula for wealth and want to amend it

 

monetary wealth = money earned/found/accumulated/inherited/etc + money spent/used + money flowed onwards (e.g. nourishing food eaten from money, things paid for and used, things given away, etc).

 

or perhaps it is more like

wealth = money earned x money spent x money flowed.

yeah i think so.

 

so really you are all a hell of a lot richer than you ever possibly thought!

 

wealth is not a static point either, it is ever accumulating and increasing. you can only ever increase in wealth, there is no decrease. you can never unwork, unspend, or unflow... it's not possible!

 

the more money you earn, the more you use it, and the more you change it back into other forms of energy..... the wealthier you are!

 

hmmmm am i approaching borderline capitalism? i personally don't think so, because the emphasis is not on accumulating massive amounts of money or even material goods.

large accumulations of material goods represent a stagnation in wealth, because it is not money that is flowed onwards, it pools and stops. it will represent only a twofold level of wealth, however flowing money or good from money onwards takes that wealth up another level.....

 

get it?

 

it's of little concern to me if it makes sense or not, to my mind it makes sense and i just thought i would put it out there as another perspective of viewing money... one that is a lot lighter on your consciousness cos you realise you are wealthy and you will always be wealthy.

 

[mbanu]

Lotta Daoists of old were crazy rich. Or if not crazy rich, big mooches.

 

Lao tzu mooched off the inert mass of bleeding money that was the Confucian government at the time. They didn't just have superfluous government jobs in the US.

 

A lot of alchemists made their entire living off of flim flam and bullshit, especially the ones who got into exorcism but didn't have the slightest fucking clue what they were doing. (Lotta those in Asia today)

 

A lot of immortals learned how to counterfeit gold somewhere along the way to their immortality.

 

There are two parts to living a life of wu wei, but the one that gets the most focus is "no dread of death", with the down and out daoists who actively confront the people inside themselves they always hoped they'd never be, living in pits in the ground full of burning garbage.

 

But there's also "no love of life". Shit, the one tenuous link to daoism that alchemy has is that if you make yourself immortal, it gives you more potential to realize how worthless life is ultimately, kinda like how if you become so rich you stay rich in spite of yourself, money ceases having any sort of meaning.

 

This isn't a 100% guarantee, as can be seen by the fact that many immortals of old, even "Daoist" immortals, weren't enlightened, they went off and became gods, playing on a larger scale the same sorta political shit they played on a smaller scale in their mortal lives. And there are some rich people who never lose the value of a dollar. That's why they're always spending it so extravagantly.

 

But poor and homeless doesn't necessarily mean holy sage. Sometimes it just means poor and homeless. Hardship gives one the potential to confront certain life truths, but nothing is guaranteed. Kinda like that old Zen anecdote about the hermit who gave up riches and glory but was always paranoid about losing his begging bowl. Just like turning into an immortal sometimes just means doing the same things on a bigger scale, sometimes becoming a poverty stricken leper just means doing the same things on a smaller scale.