Yin Spirit, Yang Spirit, and Spirit Travel

[松永道]

[宁]

http://www.universal-tao.com/article/immortals.html

 

the article you are trying to translate - i think it's already here

good topic!

 

L1

[松永道]

http://www.universal-tao.com/article/immortals.html

 

the article you are trying to translate - i think it's already here

good topic!

 

L1

 

Thanks Little1, that is the book. However, it seems Chia has decided which parts to translate and which parts not to without any mention of what he leaves out.

 

This book is the classic that the Ling Bao Bi Fa practice draws from. As such it's great importance to the Longmen Pai (Dragon Gate Lineage). I assume there must be a better translation out there but I have yet to find it. Otherwise I'll translate it someday once my skills (in language and cultivation) have matured enough.

[mantis]

very interesting, i agree with robert bruce and the document that it is easier to astral travel when very tired. the only time i've ever been successful with astral projection was when i was lacking sleep. i didn't go anywhere though since i was so shocked that it happened (it feels very, very real) i woke up.

 

interesting to note that in this case yang overcomes the yin!

 

i'd be interested to hear about the yang methods though.

[宁]

Thanks Little1, that is the book. However, it seems Chia has decided which parts to translate and which parts not to without any mention of what he leaves out.

 

This book is the classic that the Ling Bao Bi Fa practice draws from. As such it's great importance to the Longmen Pai (Dragon Gate Lineage). I assume there must be a better translation out there but I have yet to find it. Otherwise I'll translate it someday once my skills (in language and cultivation) have matured enough.

 

 

That's Eva Wong's translation, not Chia's

[gendao]

Fantastic article that really contrasts astral OBE travel with Taoist immortality together...

 

I just wonder if Gold Dragon Body = Yang immortal body or not?

 

Thank you!

[clearclouds]

[thelerner]

Rawn Clark criticized Robert Bruce's system for being too fast. His way using Franz Bardon's Hermetic system took years of training much of it in understanding and controling your shadow self.

 

Michael

[松永道]

 

I just wonder if Gold Dragon Body = Yang immortal body or not?

 

 

I wonder too. It seems the Kunlun system introduces spirit travel very early. But I don't know enough about the system to say. I like Kunlun's philosophy, but I wonder if it's methods are really the 'Great Way' Daoist speaks of, or one of these side roads.

 

I was speaking with a Daoist cultivator the other day on Yin Shen Dao and Yang Shen Dao and he that Buddhists tend to practice Yin Shen, and Daoists tend to practice Yang Shen. He also said this is the reason why Buddhist cultivators tend to be fat while the Daoists, thin. Yang energy provides heat and circulation, no need for extra chub. He seemed to allude that many Buddhist cultivators ended up with Yang deficiency, leading to fat, mucus buildup, etc. S.N. Goenka of the Buddhist Vipassana tradition would certainly conform to this stereotype. Wonderful heart, but his body is fat and phlegmy.

 

---

 

clearclouds,

 

Cool excerpt! Good description of the gui, ghost immortal.

Edited September 19, 2008 by 松永道

[Stigweard]

[三江源]

.

Edited April 4, 2015 by 三江源

[Taoist81]

In the Golden Dawn and thus Crowley's A.'.A.'. lines "journeying in the Spirit Vision", learning to "travel" in the Body of Light is one of the first things that one works on. As a Neophyte in the A.'.A.'. one's main objective is to "obtain complete control of the astral plane". One is tested on their abilities to do this by requiring the subject to, for example, go to a place in the astral already known to the testers and report what they learn, or to visit a particular symbol unknown to the Neophyte and report the meaning by what he finds there. In a few rituals of both the Golden Dawn and the A.'.A.'. they physical and astral bodies are used simultaneously (for example holding hands in one particular GD ritual), or in rapid succession (as in Liber Samekh). This version of astral travel while sharing some elements with the popular conception, is done specifically to develop the Body of Light so that ever higher realms may be visited and ever higher development may be achieved until one is able (and ready) to reach beyond the Abyss and achieve Oneness and then Noneness.

[林愛偉]

 

I was speaking with a Daoist cultivator the other day on Yin Shen Dao and Yang Shen Dao and he that Buddhists tend to practice Yin Shen, and Daoists tend to practice Yang Shen. He also said this is the reason why Buddhist cultivators tend to be fat while the Daoists, thin. Yang energy provides heat and circulation, no need for extra chub. He seemed to allude that many Buddhist cultivators ended up with Yang deficiency, leading to fat, mucus buildup, etc. S.N. Goenka of the Buddhist Vipassana tradition would certainly conform to this stereotype. Wonderful heart, but his body is fat and phlegmy.

 

---

 

 

 

No. Buddhists do not cultivate Yin anything. It is all Yang to attain wisdom and transcend the mundane. Vairochana Buddha is as bright as the sun. It is none other than Shakyamuni Buddha. A Buddha is bright and limitless in all workings .... that is Yang...but out of the relative scheme of Yin and Yang, a Buddha holds no views of Ego, Others, a Self and a Lifespan. No longer subject to birth and death, yin and yang do not exist because it only fits a relative equation, nothing more.

 

 

As for the thing about fat Buddhist...Simply rubbish. I have met fat Daoists..hahaha

 

I tell you, many Daoists love to argue about Buddhism. This is why ignorant people cultivate the Way , and stay ignorant.

 

If S.N Goenka is another name for Maitreya Buddha, then...

 

Maitreya Buddha was fat, because it was a symbol that worked for the people of that time and besides, That was only one incarnation of Maitreya, and it was to symbolize patience. The Chinese name of that incarnation was Monk Bu Dai, because he carried a cloth bag where ever he went.

 

Buddhists don't sit around, they go out in the world and offer community service. They walk in cultivation, sit, etc.

 

But seriously, you can't take that Daoist person serious. People are fat due to their karmic conditions, not because of some Yin cultivation haha ridiculous.

 

You can not get fat from practicing Yin Shen Gong, or Yin Shen or practicing any Yin energy cultivation. It Will never happen.

 

Yang Cheng Fu...Fat. I have met loads of Xin Yi people in China... who were Daoist, and many of them FAT.

 

 

Peace,

Lin

[Stigweard]

I tell you, many Daoists love to argue about Buddhism. This is why ignorant people cultivate the Way , and stay ignorant.

 

[林愛偉]

 

 

haha Meaning many Daoists like to say bad things about Buddhism, and many Buddhists like to

say bad things about Daoists.. haha

 

:-)

[Stigweard]

haha Meaning many Daoists like to say bad things about Buddhism, and many Buddhists like to

say bad things about Daoists.. haha

 

:-)

 

[松永道]

Thanks commenting Lin,

 

Admittedly, the Daoists like to show the Buddhists in bad light and vice-versa. Luckily both sides cultivate respect enough that it's never come to much more than a philosophical disagreement.

 

S.N.Goenka, by the way, is a world teacher of Vipassana meditation. Heart of gold. But not the model of health. Admittedly, from my own experience, I've seen about the same number of fat and thin Buddhists and Daoists - though the fast majority don't cultivate. But a good number of internal martial artists tend to be plump. I think when you learn to use less and less force, the body inclines towards fat or thin based on genetics and diet. I have never seen a fat cultivator of Yang Shen Dao, but then I haven't met more than a dozen, so the sample is too small to call.

 

I think we can agree Buddhists emphasize the heart, xin gong, and Daoists emphasize the vitality, ming gong. But of course, the emphasis of one need not and should not exclude the other. My experience with Vipassana did wonders for my personality and emotion.

 

In Chinese medical terms, there are really only two fundamental disharmonies of the body. One is deficiency, the other, stagnation. The doctor reduces stagnation, brings it back into circulation, and tonifies deficiency - usually in that order but not always.

 

To me, xin gong reduces. The main cause of stagnation is from thoughts and emotions (though also from external injury). To reduce stagnation, Vipassana, the only Buddhist meditation I'm familiar with, uses equanimity. Observe equanimously, that is without craving or aversion, and flow will naturally arise. However, intense reduction can leave a person deficient - and this was also my experience with Vipassana.

 

Ming gong tonifies. But the process can exacerbate stagnations you might have. Also having more energy on hand, one need be more mindful with their emotional life so as not to cause any new stagnations. On the upside, tonification can make a stagnation more obvious so as can easily reduce it.

 

 

 

What do you think Lin?

 

And may I ask, can you explain your perception of Yin Shen, Yang Shen, Yuan Shen, and Shi Shen?

[林愛偉]

 

And may I ask, can you explain your perception of Yin Shen, Yang Shen, Yuan Shen, and Shi Shen?

 

 

Peace and Blessings!

 

As for Xin Gong and Ming Gong, I have not known Buddhism to only specify one manner of such cultivation. It emphasizes cultivation of Patience, Compassion and Wisdom...it is the mind which can transform the body. I have seen that Buddhist cultivation cultivates the whole...that is mind. Once the mind is proper the body follows...doesn't take a long time as some think. Its just that mind is harder to work on than body.. lol

 

Yin Shen... cultivation of one's mind in such a manner as to attain sight and a transformation body (Form) in the realms of ghosts, spirits of lower states. Yet, they can be of the heavens and or hell realms, have forms, but hold dominant qualities of unseen principles. Like Swordsman. Many are of Yin characteristics: long hair, thin, swift and in touch with the realms that are not readily seen by the organ of sight.

 

With Yin Shen cultivation, it is the mind which transforms to attain spiritual abilities to see those states of spirits and ghosts, etc. One can become stuck in those realms though, and it would be difficult to get out! haha Those realms are messy indeedy.

 

Yang Shen... Though Yin Shen cultivation, one can attain wisdom, Yang shen is the transformation and total purification of the mind, thus body following. Attainment of immortality in "higher" realms of beings, the Yang Shen cultivation ultimately will result in (with proper teachings and guidance) Completion of one's wisdom, Buddhahood, actual immortality which does not hold its opposite of non-immortality, true and complete Thusness.

 

Yang shen cultivation results in the attainment of spiritual abilities as well, but coupled with wisdom cultivation and purification of the mind and body. This state of cultivation "opens" the mind for attainment of teachings from wise and highly cultivated beings, but if the teaching and guidance isn't proper, one can get deviant teachings, and then transform to a demon mind.

 

These above explanations are from my own experience, and have not been taught to me by teachers, or even read, so they may not be what is traditionally written about.

 

At states past relativity, there is neither here nor there. This is an ultimate state, which is not a state once attained. For to attain it, one has had to put down views of duality.

 

Cultivation as a whole, should entail the whole, in relativity; Yin and Yang, but without its particular separation in focus for cultivation. Meaning, don't just think to cultivate Yin, and or Yang. Just cultivate, and with a concentrated mind, all is "attained". Basically, in Buddhism, Yin Shen, Yang Shen, etc, is not worried about. Nothing is seen as separate, just cultivate. These bodies in cultivation are only states, and eventually will degrade.

 

Cultivation is straight through, no stops, no pauses and no focusing on small attainments. If one is not complete in their virtue, merit and wisdom, it is not the unmoved, undefiled mind. Daoist, Buddhist teachings... its all cultivation... its like going to a mechanic: The mechanic looks at the parts of the car and finds the one's needed to be changed. Then he changes the parts, and sups up the car to be really fast and well maintained, a high state of car.

 

Then again, a mechanic may want to just connect the car to a machine which takes it as a whole, and shows which areas have problems, then he can go straight to the problem, fix it, and maintain the vehicle until it can no longer be used.

 

The metaphor is to focusing on states (parts at a time) and or cultivating as a whole, controlling the mind, and directly penetrating the illusion.

 

 

 

As for Yuan Shen, and Shi Shen, never heard of those terms, so I can not explain. Not to say they don't exist, just that I never heard of it.

 

Please explain Yuan and Shi Shen...

 

Peace and Blessings,

Lin

 

 

In Chinese medical terms, there are really only two fundamental disharmonies of the body. One is deficiency, the other, stagnation. The doctor reduces stagnation, brings it back into circulation, and tonifies deficiency - usually in that order but not always.

 

To me, xin gong reduces. The main cause of stagnation is from thoughts and emotions (though also from external injury). To reduce stagnation, Vipassana, the only Buddhist meditation I'm familiar with, uses equanimity. Observe equanimously, that is without craving or aversion, and flow will naturally arise. However, intense reduction can leave a person deficient - and this was also my experience with Vipassana.

 

Ming gong tonifies. But the process can exacerbate stagnations you might have. Also having more energy on hand, one need be more mindful with their emotional life so as not to cause any new stagnations. On the upside, tonification can make a stagnation more obvious so as can easily reduce it.

What do you think Lin?

 

 

It would be dependent upon the state of the body. If tonification allows the stagnation to become more obvious, it may be a bit painful to the patient depending on the place of stagnation. On the other hand, tonification and draining may be a bit more comfortable in terms of getting the stagnant qi moving. One can tonify to a degree, drain and redirect that energy so as to move the stagnancy, and transform it.

 

I am speaking generally... Not to be taken literal. Then again, I may be too vague

 

Peace,

Lin

Edited September 22, 2008 by 林愛偉

[Dog]

I my own experience I have found that Alchemy east to west start in there way making with the five phase shen they access the virtue acceptance and element fire to support earth(trust) element and start the refining process of metal(integrity). Metal being seen as the least refined, ghosts, egotism aka stuck compartmentalization, chi is held and not returned to yuan chi. Then moving on to deeper levels. I am not say all tradition will put it into this language as there is cultural filters to deal with this is my own personal observation of what is going on at the five phase level. You also can balance this with working the micro cosmic orbit which is three so you have three times five equal 15 or 6. But the orbit will have limited success (mainly just visualization not actualization) unless the metal element is starting to be refined and the earth element increased thus helping the body mind split, or mind, heart, soul embodiment if you like..

 

Side not I love that the article calls one Structure, my feeling of one is a deep since of home of course this home is no place.

 

In my experience of "travel" is that as I refine my metal element I am able to expand out my body space and merge with greater body spaces I still move with in my own body space that is now expanded. My travels are not regulated consciously (I can make a request) but my main focus is to simply stay present and provide my smile(acceptance or allowance if you like) and inner ears. You could relate it to improvising music in which you merge with the band and crowd into an ocean of sound.

 

 

p.s. Listen with your nose