Get to know the real Procurator

[mantis]

i like procurator too, i feel like he usually knows what he's talking about.

[thelerner]

I've always found him to be remarkably negative. He mostly posts one line dismissives. Classic Proc. is when he insulted someones style as inauthentic without ever seeing it, then when pressed admitted he himself doesn't study the art.

 

Its hard to guage if he has any skill at all. Morally he seems pretty slimy to me and has for a long time.

 

 

Michael

[mYTHmAKER]

The sad thing I think is that many Chinese people would probably AGREE with him. haha

 

I am friends with many Chinese and I beg to differ

 

 

I don't know how many people I've met here (and ESPECIALLY in Korea) who believe that the you know who's are secretly running the world.

 

Me? That's the human world, and I don't care about who is or isn't running it.

 

You may be unaware but that is a bigoted statement.

Your first statement leans in the same direction.

[r.w.smith]

Well lets take a look at the Chinese. The most Racist anti western people on Earth. They call us all kinds of names,Deem us Unworthy to Attain their Secrets etc. But i dont see anybody trying to Ban the Chinese.

[growant]

To me, almost worse than the prejudice, is being cruel to someone who has done you no wrong. That is one of the worst sins, in my opinion, cruelty without provocation, undeserved.

 

It demonstrates a complete lack of compassion.

 

Can one be spiritually 'advanced' while lacking compassion?

 

This depends on whether or not the path has heart.

 

Some paths are based wholely on the heart/heart center. Many have said 'simply love,', 'love is the way', etc... Particularly many people returning from near death experiences.

 

Other paths (Castaneda's comes to mind) seem to be devoid of heart, cold, ego- focussed.

 

 

Someone may have alot of book knowledge but experience is another matter.

 

Personally, I wouldn't choose to follow a person or path that is devoid of compassion or does not lead to it.

 

Those who are devoid of compassion have probably not suffered enough yet. There is time.

[SiliconValley]

Well lets take a look at the Chinese. The most Racist anti western people on Earth. They call us all kinds of names,Deem us Unworthy to Attain their Secrets etc. But i dont see anybody trying to Ban the Chinese.

 

 

Who's calling you names on this forum, like Procurator did? May be we should not generalize this issue and stick to this particular case!

[Aetherous]

Those who are devoid of compassion have probably not suffered enough yet. There is time.

 

Either that or they haven't been shown enough compassion to know the correct way out of the cycle of suffering they're in. People that want to hurt others tend to have been hurt quite a bit themselves and are really used to pain.

 

Luckily, Taoist alchemy practices will help anyone get on the right track.

[mjjbecker]

..

Edited August 27, 2009 by mjjbecker

[Mal]

[Stigweard]

TaoBums Group Hug Time ... Brought to You by the StigMaster !!!!

 

 

[Mal]

I needed that..... bit of a scary looking hug

[Taomeow]

I needed that.....

No, what you really needed is for someone to offer you a hug and then, as soon as you open your arms, tell you, "no, I'm not doing any filthy peaceniks any favors. "

 

Consider it done. There, you feel better now.

[Mal]

O.k. Prefered the first hug

[shontonga]

Haha!

This is just like being back in the school yard!

Love it!

Folks change so much as "they" grow up!

What a bunch of freaks.

 

 

Should be some black eyes soon!

 

I'M TAKING BETS!!!

 

WHO'S IN?

 

Would hope these things would be dealt with as children

so adults can get on and enjoy their short little lives.

Except for the few who chose to ascend ,

we'll all be dead soon.

Me and you. (LOL, Unless???)

Enjoy each other!

No matter how long it really ain't that long!

 

Grow up

Some folks are assholes.

Fire burns.

Waters wet.

It's their nature.

reality.

 

There are those in charge of the site.

If harm was perceived to be done.

They have accepted responsibility

to figure a remedy as they see fit.

Allow them to do their job, take it up with them.

 

Or just keep the fires burning.

 

Either way.

 

What more.

 

Meanwhile I'm glad to hold the cash for the bets!

...don't mind that my memory is bad and I wander off at times.

I'll come back ... eventually .

 

Ps. Those hugs are all a bit freakish

and scary as heck.

 

*edited fer spellin' ... then couldn't leave well enough alone ... again!

Edited October 22, 2008 by shontonga

[Oolong Rabbit]

Regarding this latest outburst from him. The simple and plain fact is that making such a statement in many western countries now is a criminal offence. Despite any lofty ideas people may claim here, we are all subject to the laws of the countries we live in.

 

And those laws are completely evil and designed to silent dissenting opinions. Don't get me wrong, it was a totally ignorant nasty thing to say, but a crime? What the hell is this world coming to. Quick call the Thought Police!

 

 

It should be clear that I don't feel there can be any excuse for the comment made this time. It goes beyond rudeness and into racial and religious hatred. He has broken the law in many countries by making the comment he did, aside from being morally abhorrent. In Sean's position, (and I am NOT saying Sean should do this, simply that I would), I would forward his IP details on to the authorities where he lives. Should that be within the UK or another EU country, he would have to answer for his behaviour in a court of law.

 

Gimme a break. Now you are starting to sound like a Nazi. I am not so much defending Procurator's comments as taking issue with yours.

[Pietro]

Indifference to others being deliberately hurt as long as it's not you is bingo?..

 

When was the last time you heard me asking Sean to interveene, because someone has been un-nice to me?

Should I forward you the PMs I received over the years, that would make the procurator email sound a nice educated answer? (At least he explained why he wasn't answering!)

 

FACT: most human beings are either racist, or misoginist, or sexist, or homophobic, or dislike people from other parts of the worls, other cultures, other religions, or who are just called John. By most I mean more than 90%. In fact I suspect it is higher than 98%.

 

It all boils down to our genetic, and the fact that we are primates, and as monkeys we don't like monkeys of the other tribe. We dislike them. Most monkeys (and I place humans among them) would if unchecked first kill a monkey of another tribe, and then maybe feel guilty. Yes monkeys are able to have emotions similar to human beings. They can have compassion and guilt. Generally after.

 

Forcing everybody to behave does not make everybody not a racist, but makes everybody a liar. Worse, someone who is even lying to himself. I am not saying that everybody hates jews, or nigers -sorry black men- - sorry coloured men-, -sorry african american... even when they have never been to africa, or to america- , or homosexuals.

 

What I am saying is that most of us, dislike someone. And we do so for deep unexplained, often unexplainable reasons. We do this because we feel those persons as different. So what?

Get over it!

 

Some time ago I saw a really nice adv. It said: "Some people are queer! Get over it!".

 

It also works the other way: "Some people are racist! Get over it!".

 

We are practitioners, no one can change the whole world, but we can change ourselves. I find this thread shameful.

 

Tao Bums, what has happened to you? Why are we having all those threads, should this or that person be banned? You are acting like an old grumpy lady. You want the whole world to be your way or you get offended.

 

It is ok to offer compassion to a person who has been wronged, but we are not the karmic police. Let the karmic police be the karmic police, and stick to dissolve your karma.

 

Also we need to divide between what happens in PM and what happens in public. I think it is fair to expect people to keep a certain level of decency in a public forum, at least to avoid it to reach a point where actual comunication is no longer possible, but can we really expect Sean to police the PM between two adult individuals? I think Sean should just answer like Twitter did: I am sorry, but we are just a carrier, like a phone network. If you have a problem contact directly the authorities. More than that, you can ignore the PM from Procurator, what else do you want? You want him to be punished because he does not like Jews.

 

Now something about name calling, and name calling black people in particular. I come from Rome, we don't have so much weight on the world niger. We never had slavery. I mean, we never had slavery of only black people, we would just have any other population a slave. I suppose you could call us equanimous. SO when I was 3 (1973) my father explained me that there was people who had a darker skins, and those people where called negri (nigers). When I was 6 I was told that the word niger was very offensive in america and so now everybody in the world had to use the word coloured. I was naturally easygoing so I made no fuss about having to change my vocabolary. Then when I was 12 I was explained that Coloured was now considered even more offensive, and instead I had to use the word black. And finally some years ago I was explained that now the word black was offensive too and we should call black people african american. Even the ones from Italy? Even the ones from Italy.

 

Sorry but I think all this is very silly. It is walking around the problem, and not facing it. I dislike having to change my vocabulary, but I really dislike this culture of whimpering where everybody indulges in feeling wronged because someone called him in the wrong way. But he himself is allowed to use those words and those jokes. Jews can make jokes about jews, but no one else can. Black people can call people nigers, but no one else can. And let's not speak about muslim people because the situation there is even worse.

 

And what is worse is that all this is untrue. Is a fake. A play pretend. Here is where I realised it: When I grew up I use to use the word black. I used the word niger only one time. I was in the military service, and I had a friend who was also doing the military service. He was black. He was also an alpha male, ex boxer, and communist (at least we had something in common). He would get offended all the time. In a fascist culture like the italian militars, it made for an interesting contrast. Especially because being a good boxer he was very respected. AT the end of the year we had a discussion and I told him that only because he was a niger he did not have the right to be offended for every expression people used. Yes I used to word niger. That time he was not offended. Maybe being accused to be offended all the time, and then acting offended was too much, or maybe he felt there was no spitfullness behind my words. What really surprised me was that I never used that word. It was interesting that in the heat of a discussion I forgot all my political correct bullshit education, and just went for the first word I have been taught when I was a kid.

 

And to conclude, you know why I like Bruce? Because he speaks directly with no bullshit. I never heard him paraphrase something, unless he was being ironic. People get offended around him all the time. So what? He likes to be so, and if you want to learn from him you need to accept him. Yes you need to accept someone who is not politically correct. He still has compassion, he just does not pretend. And funny enough when he tries to be more politically correct his teachings arrive less strong. And there is probably a teaching even in this.

 

 

edited for grammar

Edited October 22, 2008 by Pietro

[宁]

To me, almost worse than the prejudice

....

 

Other paths (Castaneda's comes to mind) seem to be devoid of heart, cold, ego- focussed.

Someone may have alot of book knowledge but experience is another matter.

 

 

 

Speaking of prejudices... if I'd be to judge you on this statement alone, my opinion on you wouldn't be a very good one.

Also bringing it up into the public. I've been raised to act like a man, resolving things discreetly, without much fuss. And certainly not complaining and whining to others.

 

So you see, we live in different worlds.

We need compasion, yes, but we also need wisdom and a broader understanding.

If it were to happen to me, I wouldn't act the way you did, and do.

 

I hope you understand.

Peace

 

L1

[mjjbecker]

..

Edited August 27, 2009 by mjjbecker

[Mal]

Your comments were:

Spoken as people who have no understanding or concept of what it is like to have others try to obliterate your family, friends, associates, your whole race from the face of the earth.

 

True, as a middle class white male, I have no understanding of this concept. To be honest as a child I could never understand why Jewish people were descriminated against in the first place, they look the same as me. Discriminating against someone who looks "different" was always easier to understand.

 

I apologise for vendetta, but for me throwing someone to the police for a PM is way too extreme and it pushed my buttons. Obviously I am not a fan of LAWS

 

But it's all good

[sheng zhen]

To me this is very simple. I used to like Procurator too, and thought he had some kind of authentic taoist experience. But what is shown here is a man with a very fixed mind that judges individuals based on generalized and fixed concepts. Something must have been very wrong with his cultivation.

 

How can you be in union with the tao, that is changing and rearranging every moment, when your mind is fixed on generalized concepts???

 

I have lost my respect for Procurators opinions. He should take his medication or atlest do his meditation properly.

Edited October 22, 2008 by sheng zhen

[Pero]

You are acting like an old grumpy lady.

 

 

It is ok to offer compassion to a person who has been wronged, but we are not the karmic police. Let the karmic police be the karmic police, and stick to dissolve your karma.

 

"Compassion".

[mjjbecker]

..

Edited August 27, 2009 by mjjbecker

[seadog]

I remember meeting this kid one day,he couldn't have been more then ten years old.We were just talking about this and that then out of no were he says.

"I hate Jews"

I was taken back for a minute, then asked;

"Why"

Off he went on this mad tirade about how "they" try to control the world and everybody in it.Blah blah blah

Now obviously somebody has taught him, because he is ten years old and he doesn't know his shit from his shoelaces.

So I asked him.

"How do you know so much about Jewish people?"

He replied.

"My dad told me."

Thats the thing with hatered it can spread like cancer and infect anyone who is not immune to it.This post is a example.

Only a fool underestimates its power

Wisdom,understanding and the power to forgive have been and always will be the anitdote to hatered.

[sean]

I haven't been ignoring this topic.

 

In fact I've been following it intently, mulling over what to do.

 

First, on a personal note ...

 

I've always found Procurator pointlessly abrasive. He adopts the ultra-safe position of untouchable critic by revealing close to nothing about himself as a human being. Instead he stands on the sidelines preferring to cut down things with which he doesn't agree, with seething one liners, rarely contributing anything of substance in return. I find this a very common position taken in online forums, and in my opinion it reflects social insecurity.

 

Now it's become clear that Procurator is an unabashed racist.

 

One of the most deeply ignorant worldviews possible, in complete opposition to reality.

 

Race is merely an extremely fuzzy, social ("folk") classification strategy based on superficial visual characteristics that are the result of about .01 percent of our genetic makeup (which can rapidly shift in response to, ie: weather).

 

Consider this: the genetic difference between two randomly selected Jewish individuals is just as likely to be significantly greater than the difference between many living Jewish women and our beloved Procurator.

 

So when Procurator and other confirmed racists indulge in their race-based conspiracy theories, they are using an arbitrary taxonomy to further sheer. ignorant. paranoid. nonsense.

 

Rational critique of individuals or groups is best based on the moral disagreements you have with their beliefs and the actions they are taking. Otherwise you are just promoting superstition.

 

Now, with all that said, unfortunately I can't suspend/ban Procurator.

 

This may come as a shock, and I truly apologize to anyone offended by my decision. Please know that I didn't arrive at it lightly.

 

I try to abide by principles in my administrative decisions here, and this is a weird case.

 

The biggest complication is that Procurator's insult occurred through private message.

 

I simply can't police this area of the forum. (Within reason, if someone is preemptively spamming other members through pm with personal attacks, this would be another weird case for me to meditate on).

 

Even though, subjectively I feel close to certain you are telling the truth growant, disputes within this arena will always boil down to one person's word against another.

 

Technically I could probably hack into the database to verify, but this opens up privacy concerns for the rest of the members and sets a strange precedent.

 

I'm sorry this community was a space for you to be insulted like this, and I hope that you can understand how I arrived at my decision, and that it was not for a lack of sensitivity to what happened here.

 

Feel free to keep an eye on Procurator for me and report him if he brings his hatred into the common area.

 

And feel free to voice your opinions about my decision, I appreciate your feedback.

 

Take care,

Sean

[Wayfarer64]

I'm not in the least surprised.

He has been on my ignore list for quite some time.

I believe that such behavior should result in a permanent ban.

He is free to hate who he chooses but this action is reprehensible.

 

 

likewise I've had that guy ignored for a long time- the anti-jewish thing is still a surprise such intolorance/ignorance is rare here..

 

 

it shows just how fools can wander where wisemen fear to tread

 

Sean -I admire you as I admire the ACLU protecting any speach is fine by me -learning who the misguided are is always welcome, then perhaps they can be helped to open their minds and hearts to a wider world view

 

& please remember folks (karmicly thinking) -such hatered harms the purvayor more than the object of hate

Edited October 23, 2008 by Wayfarer64