resonance Posted July 23, 2009 Hi Resonance, I'm glad you added that. I wanted to add something like that to my post but I really don't want people here to think that I think that I am a "know-it-all". It is true, everything in the universe, all things, are conditioned by the processes of Tzujan including Tao (which is a non-thing). Human life, I think, is among the most conditioned things in the universe (afterall, we are among the most recent manifestations in the universe). And I will agree with your suggestion that a "pure you" is something very, very rare, if one exists at all. I think that the best we can do is to remove those conditioned aspects of ourself that prevent us from finding inner peace and contentment. Be well! Hello Marblehead...im glad you are glad lol...hope im not coming over as a "know it all"! To be honest i dont post much on the net and when i do i cringe a bit at what is written, it is an unforgiving medium and lacks so much that person to person communication has..never the less i find that in itself a good thing too. None of my teachers have been advocates of 'self improvement' there most common advice was "stop struggling! Leave yourself alone!" The view was WuWei...pesonally im going to try not to use to much 'taoist' terminology as there are almost as many interpretations of it as there are practitioners lol [ im joking a bit here!] Purity? Whats pure? Whats impure? What can be aware of both? Some would say that being embodied is the reason for 'conditioning' they then become frantic trying to 'get away', wanting to become beings of light or 'spirit' or some such...jing/chi/shen are not other to each other but aspects of each other or of life...we flip and flop between catagorizing our experiences as pure/impure, nice/not nice, material/spiritual etc but what is consistant throughout? Is consistancy even possible or desirable? I feel 'not knowing' is fine. I agree that if a person is uncomfortable for some reason it is natural to want to change circumstances for the better. Man I ramble...peace Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Marblehead Posted July 23, 2009 Hi Resonance, Nice comments. Just want to comment on one thing you mentioned: ... their most common advice was "stop struggling! Leave yourself alone!" The view was WuWei... Wu wei, in my opinion, does not mean doing nothing. It is more at doing naturally. Responding when conditions require a response else do nothing. Many of the Hippies during the sixties got this confused. Most did nothing - just sucked off the efforts of others. That is not Tao. This concept applied to the individual person suggests that if there is something we should do, we do it. If we need make a change in our life we make the change then we leave it alone. Yes, we will even sometimes have to struggle - to change a bad habit or whatever. (Actually, we shouldn't even have habits, we should live spontaneously although this can be very difficult because of our need to earn a dollar.) Be well! Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Oldman Posted July 28, 2009 That is a very beautiful piece of wordsmithing. It was very introspective, so to speak, and yet I sometimes wonder..... and would offer a counterpoint. Not in dispute, rather as a complement or companion, ponder this: While it can be good to look closely at self and our place in the universe, it is also good to forget self and look at our companions. The fact that we are all experiencing this here and this now gives us delightful things to do in service of others. Sometimes the best meditation is to chop wood, carry water and do whatever else we think may be beneficial to our companions in this here and now. Is the ecstasy of oneness with the universe really any better than the mild pleasure of creating a smile on a face that previously held a grimace? If all we do is clean our own yard the neighborhood can still look like crap. But it is our responsibility to clean our yard. Cleaning the neighborhood is our opportunity. I think that chi is a little bit like money in that it is good to have some around but its real use is when you spend it. Don't hold back. Empty to be filled. Your 25,000 days will be over before you know it but that is still over 2 trillion seconds of opportunity. Who knows what comes next? I love qiqong so much. But in my garden I grow many flowers, some not so perfect, others pretty ok. Another garden may have perfect roses or tiger lilies beyond compare. I have great admiration for the refinement of those intricate works but still prefer the variety of my simple unsophisticated garden. In the end there is unity without uniformity. I suppose there will be some who say the old man just doesn't get it. Missed the point completely he did. To those I would offer a very humble "So What". Right now I am unreasonably, illogically, maybe its the dementia, what's the matter with that guy, happy. As don Juan said, "If all you lose is your mind, you haven't lost much." Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Marblehead Posted July 28, 2009 Hi Oldman, Nice post. Okay, I was brought back here so I will make one additional comment to Resonance's post. I feel 'not knowing' is fine. I totally agree. However, I would like to point out that this is true as long as one understands that they do not know. When one 'does not know' but thinks they do is a flaw. Be well! Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Blissmusic Posted August 7, 2009 "Rather than enter meditation as a person trying to become more conscious, enter meditation with the realization that you are consciousness. Not as an affirmation, but as the truth. What you are exists beyond thoughts, beyond physicality. Take away all thought, what is left? If you like, use the method: 'who am I?' Which is to ask: ' What am I beyond thinking?' ' What is this that I keep referring to as "I"? What is this sense of existing in this moment?' It will take you back beyond the mind, to where there is no answer, where there is only consciousness. Somehow you keep turning your back on this truth. Or you turn it into knowledge, a belief that you no longer validate but hold in your pocket like a lucky charm. And you end up again involved with thoughts, as though the thoughts make up a person, and that person is you, and this person has to find freedom from itself. Rather realize from the start, that you are consciousness. And the way to yourself is not to seek outside of yourself. But to let yourself rest in this moment as you truly are. No need to deny anything, no need to convince the mind what is real. Just be honest about what is here. Whenever you look beyond the mind, the truth exists, naked and pure and absolute. This is meditation. Blessings, Kip" Want to Feel Blissful? For Tons of Free Teachings on Meditation & Awareness Visit the How to Become Awakened Website Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Marblehead Posted August 7, 2009 Hi Blissmusic, Nice. For me, you are speaking of "Awareness". And even while in deep meditation there is awareness. Not conscious awareness but unconscious awareness (of all externals). In my understanding this is where we can find 'our' truths - when we do not alter reality with our delusions. And I agree, without consciousness (of self) we would be little more than a vegetable. Be well! Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Blissmusic Posted August 14, 2009 "When you feel your chest contracting, when there is stress and despair, that is a good sign that you are trying to control what cannot be controlled. That is a good sign that the best thing you can do is surrender and allow yourself to experience what is there. Thoughts of strategies, justification and even revenge could be swirling around like a hurricane, offering you something to hold on to. But it is best to let them go, to trust and allow, to be vulnerable and humble and absolutely present with what you feel. Such times are tests on your awareness. It is one thing to be blissful, sitting in a quiet air conditioned room with lovely music. It is another thing to be present when all hell seems to be breaking loose around you. There are always two paths in every moment: the path of control, and the path of surrender and awareness. And the two paths take you in two completely different directions. Most people walk in circles: they surrender a little then back to control, surrender and back to control. What would happen if you just remained aware, surrendering to what is in every moment? You can decide that today you choose peace in every moment and it could alter your entire life. Blessings, Kip" How to Be Blissful: For Tons of Free Teachings on Meditation & Awareness Visit the Questions on Spiritual Enlightenment Website Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Marblehead Posted August 14, 2009 Hi Blissmusic, You know what? That was probably the hardest lesson for me to learn. I had always felt that I could overpower and destroy these negative emotions. It was a recurring fight. What helped me out a few years back was a little book titled "When Things Fall Apart" by Pema Chodron. Now I am tippy-toeing into Native American Spirituality and that helps as well. Thanks for sharing your work! Be well! Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Blissmusic Posted August 21, 2009 "If you greet someone and ask them how they are, they will refer to the last few hours, weeks or months for an answer. Thoughts of the past are constantly repeating themselves and that becomes who you think yourself to be. You might wake up in the morning feeling blissful, and then the thought arises that 3 days ago you got a speeding ticket. And now you don't feel blissful, now you feel awful. It is like you are getting that speeding ticket over and over! How many times will you get that same ticket in your mind? If your mind was reality, they would have already taken away your license, probably your car too. But it was just that once. Over and done with. It has nothing to do with how you are in this moment. It always come down to the mind. The mind is the troublemaker. Not the thoughts themselves but the identification with them. The attachment to them. If I ask how you are, it has nothing to do with how you were yesterday or the week before or even a minute ago. It has to do with right now. Right now how are you truly? Without referring to your history how are you in this moment? You cannot really answer except to say that in this moment there is the sense of existence and you are aware of existence. not as a person with a history but as existence itself, pure impersonal being. And if you are aware of existence then you are blissful. There are no two ways about it. If you are aware of the one impersonal existence in this moment, you are blissful. All problems solved. Now go pay your speeding ticket. Blessings, Kip" Want to Feel Blissful? For Tons of Free Teachings on Meditation & Awareness Visit the How to Become Awakened Website Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Blissmusic Posted September 4, 2009 "The mind functions by defining. And through definitions boundaries are created, separation is created. There is this body that is me and everything else that is not me. So you experience something the mind defines as pain in your chest and that pain is separate from you. It is something that is happening to you. It is alien to you and a threat to you and therefore something must be done about it. This is the natural process of the mind. It is how the physical body survives. Most people try and approach meditation from this mind perspective. How can I, as this body get bliss and get away from pain. And so begins the struggle and suffering of frustrating meditations that bear little fruit because you have already separated yourself from your experience. But you can be free of all of this in an instant. Simply by closing your eyes and allowing yourself to experience what is truly here beyond thought. By 'feeling' what is here without defining or describing. Without the mind, all that is left is sensation. An experience of energy, conscious energy, that has no boundaries. What you experienced before as pain is now simply a movement of energy. Instantly you are free of all separation and conflict. All stress and self-importance goes out the window. The mind / body experience becomes something you witness inside you rather than you inside it. So awareness is completely uncomplicated. This simple shift in perspective changes everything in an instant. Simply by removing the mind as the perceiver, what was an experience of incessant conflict now is just conscious energy; An experience of unconditional peace. Blessings, Kip" Want to Feel Blissful? For Free Teachings on Meditation & Awareness Visit the How to Become Awakened Website Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
DalTheJigsaw123 Posted September 10, 2009 Thank you! Much appreciated. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
DalTheJigsaw123 Posted September 12, 2009 This was great! Thank you. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Marblehead Posted September 12, 2009 Nice. Thanks for sharing. Happy Trails! Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Blissmusic Posted September 18, 2009 "In this moment, you cannot be the person you want yourself to be or others want you to be. You can only be how you are in this moment. Happiness does not come by emulating the peaceful smiling Buddhist monk, or the tan new age guru promising you riches and the soulmate of your dreams. The secret is you are exactly as you are supposed to be in this moment. Your experience is exactly as it is supposed to be in this moment. That you keep turning away from yourself in search of something better is what breaks your heart. The doorway to unconditional peace, love and bliss is through the awareness of you, exactly as you are in this moment. In the full acceptance and awareness of yourself in this moment, you immediately transcend it. You enter into a whole new reality free from definitions, descriptions, and separation. You with your sweaty armpits your cranky disposition and your insanity is the doorway to Divinity. Because if you really become aware of what is here in this moment, you will find it is has nothing to do with what you think. Blessings, Kip" Want to Feel Blissful? For Free Teachings on Meditation & Awareness Visit the Questions on Spiritual Enlightenment Website Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Capital Posted September 19, 2009 My question is how you move that to something that is not solitary and helps the community, which is a strong part of the Tao. That feeling of being completely free from thought and conscious connection is wonderful, but you can't function like that in any way I can think of. Is there a way to? Is it possible to help others, and yet be free from it all yourself? Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
xakarii Posted September 19, 2009 (edited) "...in any way I can think of." Ain't that the truth. No thinking! When there is no mind, no self and no separation your actions are naturally beneficial to those whom you come into contact without imagining that you are helping some "other person". If you can fully recognize your essence in everything else then helping the Real Self comes naturally and without effort as a byproduct of selflessness. IE: If you help someone in need from the perspective of the ego you are really just trying to help your false self and mental contortions; the same help from a perspective of what's sometimes called "no mind" or oneness is not spurred by thought but by a direct knowledge of the fact that you're helping oneness, the Real Self, or the all in all. Not to say that the mind doesn't play any role in helping others, only that it generally skews it toward goals and limitations. How many folks give to the poor in an effort to help clear their own conscience or advance in spiritual pursuits compared to the number that truly realize that they are helping themselves as a condition of their natural state of being, without mental motivation. Edited September 19, 2009 by xakarii Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Blissmusic Posted September 24, 2009 "I often hear people saying they can't meditate. But what they are really saying is they won't meditate. Whatever reasons they give, the truth is in meditation they have come across an experience they do not wish to experience. Whether they are conscious of it or not, they have felt a sensation that they do not wish to feel. The reasons on top of this are just excuses. The moment you allow yourself to experience those sensations you are avoiding, then you see the futility of your reasons, the futility of your thoughts. The futility of trying to figure it all out. It really has nothing to do with mind. You just didn't want to feel a certain sensation, and once you did, it wasn't so bad, ironically, it was quite blissful. Suddenly you are filled with love and peace until the next sensation you unconsciously resist makes itself known. Once you realize this one very simple point, that the reason you can't meditate is that you do not wish to feel a certain sensation, then meditation becomes very clear. Then you see the power is in your hands. Most people are just looking for the bliss and they don't want to do the work to get it. And that is perfectly fine, a little relaxation and meditation will give you this. But if you want more than this. If you want freedom from this constant conflict of seeking pleasure and avoiding pain and all the stress & suffering that goes with it, then you will be willing to sit through the uncomfortable experiences and enjoy the peace that goes with it. Unconditional peace does not come from feeling happy all the time. Unconditional peace comes by being present with what is here regardless of how you think it feels. You give it a try and I bet you'll really like it. Blessings, Kip" Learn How a Simple Tool Can Make Meditation Easy Visit the Zen Enlightenment Website Want to Feel Blissful? For Tons of Free Teachings on Meditation & Awareness Visit the How to Become Awakened Website Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Blissmusic Posted October 10, 2009 "The nature of awareness is freedom from identification. If you are aware of anger, then you are not identified with anger. If you are aware of a thought, you are not identified with the thought. The thought arises, the anger arises but it has nothing to do with you. Identification is always happening at an unconscious level. You are walking to work and unconsciously identification is there. 'My name is Jon, I am a dentist, I am on Main st. where I turn left to go to my office...' Always defining 'This is me.' 'This is who I am; this is where I am; this is what I am doing; this is where I am going; this is where I have been.' So instead of practicing awareness from the perspective of identity, you could try consciously not being identified with anything. You allow the thoughts, body and sensations to be as they are but you consciously disidentify with them. 'This body is not mine, this name is not mine, these thoughts are not mine, this emotion is not mine, this belief is not mine.' Not as words to repeat but to consciously not identify with anything at all. If you choose to not have an identity then awareness is automatic. You will experience life in a completely different way. By consciously letting go of all identity, you exist as energy, as formless consciousness completely free of ego & all the conflict and separateness that goes with it. Blessings, Kip" Want to Feel Blissful? For More Free Teachings on Meditation & Awareness Visit the How to Become Awakened Website Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
宁 Posted October 10, 2009 loosing identity - the way to enlightenment?? i must be reading this wrong... Jeez! Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
rain Posted October 12, 2009 loosing identity - the way to enlightenment?? i must be reading this wrong... Jeez! I don't know about enlightenment but entering beyond concept is healthy Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
宁 Posted October 13, 2009 it is, yet i feel it must come only after 'concept' is clear and functional, otherwise it only works as a lousy excuse... Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Blissmusic Posted October 15, 2009 "There is no end to trying to figure it out. The mind is an endless puzzle that has no solution. If it had a solution, that would be the end of the reign of mind, and the mind does not want that. The mind wants to exist and it gets it's power from you identifying with thinking. And so it continues to grab your attention any which way it can. Just like a TV channel. The TV channel's purpose is to keep you watching. That is what it wants. So you are sitting there and the TV channel puts you on a tropical island with beautiful people, then you are flying an airplane, then you are chasing bad guys. But it has nothing to do with what is actually happening. What is actually happening is you are sitting on the couch, drinking a cup of tea. But in your experience, there is no couch or tea. How could there be when you are flying an airplane? It is the same with mind. The thoughts are constantly grabbing your attention. And so the world you know to be real is made up of your thoughts. But if you really look beyond your thinking at what is here, you would experience something totally different than what the mind perceives. Something that even if I tried to describe to you, you would miss. Because then it would become knowledge, it would become an interpretation of what is actually here. For you to truly find out what is here beyond interpretation, you have to look. It is this looking that is most important, it is the witnessing what is here that sets you free. Whether you are witnessing thoughts witnessing sensations it is all about the witnessing not the objects themselves. Not the knowledge of what you witnessed a second ago, but the looking right here and now. Not witnessing to get something, because then you are back in the mind. The witnessing itself is fulfillment. The witnessing itself is joy. This is the key to freedom. Blessings, Kip" Discover a Unique CD that Can Help Awaken Freedom & Joy Inside You Visit The Kundalini Shaktipat CD Website Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
deci belle Posted October 17, 2009 loosing identity - the way to enlightenment?? i must be reading this wrong... Jeez! yup Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Blissmusic Posted November 6, 2009 You cannot realize the Self through the senses. You cannot taste it, see it, hear it, smell it and you cannot touch it. You have your eyes open. You see and then label what you see. 'This is my body.' 'This is my computer.' 'I am using my hands to type on the computer.' But close your eyes and be still. From this point of stillness tell me about your hands. If you can't see them, then where and what are they? You can say that you feel them resting on your mouse or keyboard. But what is that feeling? What is the sensation that you are calling your hands? Forget the defining that they are your hands and actually experience what is here beyond the words. With your eyes closed forget the defining of your body and experience what you refer to as your body. Not a part of it but the whole thing. There is the sensation that you are here, but instead of defining it as a body, as a name, simply feel it. Feel the sensation of what is here. Feeling without touching. Feeling without using words. Here you experience something that you cannot define, you cannot accurately describe. Because what is here does not have boundaries, cannot be described by the senses. But there is an experience of existing. There is the awareness of existing. Here, existing and awareness are one and the same. This is not something that you can learn or understand. You have to close your eyes, let go of thinking and experience it. You will see it is not a state that comes and goes. It is what is always here whether you give it attention or not. Blessings, Kip" Recommended: Want to Feel Blissful? For More Free Teachings on Meditation & Awareness Visit the How to Become Awakened Website Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Marblehead Posted November 6, 2009 Hi Kip, I read the thread title and thought, "Now here is something that I can disagree with." Hehehe. After reading the post I was delighted. Very nice post and thoughts that accompied it. Thanks for sharing. Peace & Love! Share this post Link to post Share on other sites