Magus of Java Teachings Revealed

[mjjbecker]

..

Edited August 27, 2009 by mjjbecker

[Spirit Ape]

Well apart from level 3 , John Chang helped his student knock over the boxes in the clip giving a Yin energy field so his Yang Qi can now knock over the boxes. So apart from the help of John Chang what is the difference of someone doing dan tian compression breathing from there own system. I know that my own system uses these methods level 1,2 that you speak of, i would be interested in knowing more about there Yin Yang Gong of level 4 Mo Pai!

 

I think you will be suprised how many traditional kung fu system use level 1,2 of Mo Pai that train both nei and wai dan methods. Cant talk about the rest of the levels of Mo Pai cause i dont know anymore then what has been said and what i know about it.

 

Spirit Ape

[mantis]

Well apart from level 3 , John Chang helped his student knock over the boxes in the clip giving a Yin energy field so his Yang Qi can now knock over the boxes. So apart from the help of John Chang what is the difference of someone doing dan tian compression breathing from there own system. I know that my own system uses these methods level 1,2 that you speak of, i would be interested in knowing more about there Yin Yang Gong of level 4 Mo Pai!

 

I think you will be suprised how many traditional kung fu system use level 1,2 of Mo Pai that train both nei and wai dan methods. Cant talk about the rest of the levels of Mo Pai cause i dont know anymore then what has been said and what i know about it.

 

Spirit Ape

 

i believe jim can't knock it down with john chang present so there goes that

[Spirit Ape]

Thats right! He could project strong Yang Qi but John Chang has the Yin to make them either come together or repel and it causes the boxes to fall. Still that is a huge feet for Jim Sifu as he must of built up alot of Qi to send to boxes.

 

Ape

[froggie]

Without a teacher, you can't. That is the truth of it. Not the answer people want to see, but there it is.

 

There is a reason why I made the gasoline and spark plugs comment. There is a LOT more DETAIL to the process. Him explaining a little bit more isn't going to help. In fact, I suspect him throwing in his comment is likely to lead to a few people 'experimenting', at no small risk to themselves. It has been pointed out before, PEOPLE DIED WORKING THIS STUFF OUT. Followers of teachers volunteered to try out different methods, at great cost. Play around with stuff if you want, but understand the risk.

 

I can't 'afford' to do what I have done. It has been a huge sacrifice, years of it. It continues to be. If you want to do some things, there is the price to be paid. In time, as well as money.

Gasoline and spark plugs...

 

Yes, the use of tension and relaxation is part of many schools. How many people are out there like John Chang that you know of though?

 

I would add, understand the correct method, understand how to do it correctly, find a teacher who will teach and guide you and who can do this themselves, most importantly perhaps-have the God given ability to achieve it, THEN you might realise this level.

 

I believe that what you say about that it takes time is true. And also the rest.

But for the rest i could also say "never say never". Sure, a teacher would be the most ideal and possibly even the nicest. But i think it would go too far to say it would not be possible, in another way. It's pretty hard to get that point across though. But in any case, at least theoretically, and to some degree, it would be useful and maybe even desired to learn about it more in other ways, also.

[mwight]

i believe jim can't knock it down with john chang present so there goes that

 

jim could do it alone if he had something to negatively ionize the air beforehand.

Edited November 29, 2008 by mwight

[Trash Filter]

I imagine it takes a very long time to gather that much energy, and according to the books once your at 3 to go to 4 there is still some dependence on the type of aura you possess. Apparently, even at finishing the main steps of 3 there is no guarantee you are even able to go to 4 whilst this condition exists.

 

4 is where you no longer need a yin field from another i presume. the book mentions the doubling of power after 3 which suggests to me that other chakras could be filled/opened, and dantien move there and they then return to the center, much like the 4 stage. All 72 chakra points. Major power ups.

[Spirit Ape]

Where can i see the 72 chakra system?

 

Thanks inteteresting comments!

[Taiji Bum]

Not everyone here thinks you NEED a teacher. I think the right person with the wrong method will succeed and the wrong person with the right method will fail.

[h.uriahr]

Neither one of Kosta's books give you anything more than pieces. It's a mechanical system so unless you do it exactly the right way youre not going to get anywhere with it. The books are interesting but that's about it.

 

Sincere enthusiasm is a good thing. Keep going.

 

Unfortunately there is a lot more to it than you think. No, it can't all be done by just using 'will'. Unfortunately there is another member here masquerading as a member of the Mo Pai and who keeps banging on about meditation. It is not just meditation.

 

Yes, intent can move qi, but opening up channels requires certain methods and practices first. I've posted this interview before but have a read as it is very good:

 

http://www.chinafrominside.com/ma/bagua/machuanxu.html

 

Neigong absolutely DOES require moving exercises. I know this directly from John Chang and comments he made while I was in his house with Kostas. This certainly applies for levels one through three. Level four and above I don't know.

 

The method for level one is not contained within the book, never mind any of the higher levels. The books were never meant to be instructional. The second book, 'Neigong', originally had a completely different title. The publisher changed the title and wrote the blurb to make more coin. Alas that is the 'way' of business.

 

If you would like to learn more about qi then I recommend my brother Santiago. He does the KAP courses.

 

Best,

 

Mike

 

With meditation also goes breath control, which all of the shit is put into the same bin as meditation. Different kinds obviously but meditation none the less. Visualization, breathing, etc. Kosta is something else isnt he?

[mjjbecker]

..

Edited August 27, 2009 by mjjbecker

[Prince...]

"When I was young,"John began,"I really did not pay attention to the different things that my teacher, Liao Sifu, had told me about metaphysics. I was not really interested, you see; I wanted simply to learn to fight and to have power. But many of the things came back to me later.

pg 117 Magus of Java

 

"Before I went up to the mountain, in my hear tof hearts, I did not really believe in God. Oh, I used to go to church every Sunday, for I am nominally a Christian, but I had no faith; I went to church matter-of-factly. When I was up in the mountain, I wanted to experience God for myself, to see if He was real or not.

pg 123 Magus of Java

 

This is not something that I teach; I have students who are Christian, Buddhist, Muslim, skeptics like yourself, and more. Neikung has no basis in religious theory.

pg 126 Magus of Java

 

I was really miserable. As I said, there is nothing like ignorance to make a man feel safe. To better understand the future, I began to study the past. I learned that what John was now teaching me had been discovered, experienced, and categorized by many diverse ethnic groups throughout the centuries, foremost among them being my own ancestors. There is nothing new under the sun.

pg 13 Neikung the Secret Teachings of the Warrior Sages

 

I wanted to share those quotes the next time a Magus of Java thread popped up...sorry I haven't really been lurking as of late.

 

I can't say that I have seen this much on TB, but on other sites, I see people that get excited over their discovery of Mo-Pai and demand access to the teachings...because they are on some spiritual quest, they don't want to spend another lifetime here "wandering aimlessly" and John Chang is their salvation...their key to becoming enlightened.

 

I read this book and I'll be honest (unlike the majority of the people that post about Mo-Pai)-- I just wanted to learn it to fight. I've been away from home in the military for the last 4 years. Kids are getting caught with guns in schools weekly. There are no less than 3 violent crimes reported on the news every morning here, and I bet you thought the only thing hot in Nashville was the country music! The world is not such a nice place and often times people don't play fair.

 

For me, I realize that it's more important to find something that works for me. Kostas spends much of the second book finding evidence of The Thunder Path in other traditions. Personally, I would like to find Christian Neikung, if such a thing exists. I know this is Tao Bums, but there are some who follow Lao Tse, some follow Shakyamuni, there are a few Suffi Muslims, but I love Christ Jesus. I also love kungfu. If I never get good at kungfu, never develop any abilities that would even put me at level 1 of the Mo-Pai system, but I am able to love God and love my neighbor as my self--which is the ONLY doctrine Christians are supposed to follow-- well then I have accomplished something far greater.

[Vajrasattva]

pg 117 Magus of Java

pg 123 Magus of Java

pg 126 Magus of Java

pg 13 Neikung the Secret Teachings of the Warrior Sages

Personally, I would like to find Christian Neikung, if such a thing exists. I know this is Tao Bums, but there are some who follow Lao Tse, some follow Shakyamuni, there are a few Suffi Muslims, but I love Christ Jesus. I also love kungfu. If I never get good at kungfu, never develop any abilities that would even put me at level 1 of the Mo-Pai system, but I am able to love God and love my neighbor as my self--which is the ONLY doctrine Christians are supposed to follow-- well then I have accomplished something far greater.

 

 

Christian nei Gung = Ilmu Kebatinan

 

Christ Got it from GOD & the archangels direct as did other Prophets.

 

How did Moses part the red sea???

[goldisheavy]

Christ Got it from GOD & the archangels direct as did other Prophets.

 

Anyone can get it straight from God. Another way to put it is this -- make your own mind your teacher. But this IS NOT EASY. Making your own mind the teacher is as hard as following a Guru. Harder. Guru says words you understand but to hear your own mind you have to do two things. One is you have to actively probe it via questions and experimental intentions, and you also have to listen without being overly active. The problem is that "listening" is not a passive mode. Listening is creative in the sense that your beliefs still condition your mind/being and still manifest, so you are not listening to what's "out there", but you are listening to your own belief. It's not objective. Change your belief and listen again and a different "thing" is "out there".

 

You can die from this only if you push yourself too hard. If you enter into an experience that contradicts your mindset too severely, that's when you can die. When you understand this danger and how it works, it's relatively safe to explore on your own. In fact, it's the best way.

 

How did Moses part the red sea???

 

Simple -- he didn't know it couldn't be parted. He intended to part it the same way you intend to scratch your head. How do you scratch your head? It's not a step by step process. You don't have to activate your chi to scratch your head. You just do it. The same with the red sea. What prevents it are the contradicting beliefs. That's the "doubting Thomas" effect.

 

Anyway, Jesus was a bit of an idiot. He was in interesting guy, but he did much damage to humanity with the manner he communicated himself. He could have explained things much better and he could have made it explicit not to start any religions in his name, but he failed on both counts.

 

There are many spiritual giants in the world who can start new religions, even right now. I hope they don't. If they do, I will oppose them, and I am also not too shabby myself. I always prevail, of that there is no doubt. So I ask people to share and to stop spreading fear and ignorance. What we need are good spiritual friends and not the secret clubs.

[Prince...]

Christian nei Gung = Ilmu Kebatinan

 

Christ Got it from GOD & the archangels direct as did other Prophets.

 

How did Moses part the red sea???

 

Thanks Santi, I hope one day when I get farther along to study with you at some point in the future. Also, I read The Magus of Strovolos who says alot of things that mirror what John Chang says in the Magus of Java. That teacher is a Cypriot healer practicing Christian Mysticism. He passed away in the '90s, but his school is open to all faiths, even though it is essentially Christian Mysticism. He talks about reincarnation, chakras, and all sorts of stuff, along with performing bonesetting, exorcisms, mind reading, and uhh...the out of body things ( i don't know the proper term).

 

As for the comment about Jesus being an idiot...well, I am sure you are familiar with the telephone game. Things get lost over time...if the message of Christ does not resonate with you, then perhaps you march to the beat of a different drummer. Good luck falling in step with whatever beat it is that you choose.

[goldisheavy]

if the message of Christ does not resonate with you

 

I find Christ's message to be interesting and worthy of investigation. However I seriously don't like the manner in which he spoke. He failed to be direct. He failed to be simple. His use of allegories and metaphors was over the top. I like to use metaphors myself, but I try to set them up and to explain them. I don't just say one sentence with 10 metaphors embedded in it and say "he who has ears will hear". That's like saying,

 

"AADFSDS!!!!SDFslkdfjsjjsj....!!!!SSDF -- this mysterious code is the root of life, he who has the mind will understand!"

 

And you know what, if your mind is bright enough, you can deduce the meaning of life and enlightenment from it, you really CAN! BUT IS IT NECESSARY to talk like that? Is it compassionate? Is it kind? NO IT IS NOT. If you talk like that you are an asshole. If Jesus appeared in front of me I wouldn't hesitate to tell him he was a selfish asshole. His message was perfect in his mind but he didn't give a damn how approachable it was to others. Fact is, even if you chew things through, they are hard, never mind when you talk in riddles. Shame on Jesus.

 

The riddly and twisted nature of books like Bible has resulted in much suffering. Buddhist Sutras, in comparison, are vastly more straightforward and down to earth in their exposition style. Not that I agree with everything Buddha said, but the way Buddha communicated was infinitely better to Christ. The way Chuang Tzu communicated was even better than Buddha, because Chuang Tzu had humor and Buddha was a humorless toad.

Edited December 3, 2008 by goldisheavy

[Mal]

Not everyone here thinks you NEED a teacher. I think the right person with the wrong method will succeed and the wrong person with the right method will fail.

 

Yes. It depends on the purpose of the method too. Is it designed as a stand alone system where you actually CAN go away and practice by yourself eg kunlun {since it's been a while since we had a kunlun flame war may as well mention it here} Or is it something where the teacher needs to guide you and help/follow/assist your progress.

 

But there is a huge difference between just learning stuff from a book for "fun" or "interest sake" and taking a book describing some cool stuff and trying to reverse engineer a complete system of practice from that.

 

I teach for a living, and I can say without any shadow of a doubt that while a student could learn some semblance of English using books and CD's, it would be nowhere near as good as having a teacher there to correct and guide.

 

A teacher can certainly speed things up. That's why I decided to track down a teacher.

 

I know people say that teachers are not out there..... what you WANT may not be out there in a way that you are willing to access.

 

e.g. I'm sure my kung fu teacher won't be teaching for many more years. The ONLY reason I am still in this town is so that I can learn with him. Once he stops teaching I'm looking at moving to Brisbane (which I do not want to do) just to keep learning kung fu. So it will be a while before I actually get to do what I want to do. Which is move to Cairns.

[Taiji Bum]

The parable's Jesus taught with contained Kabbalistic symbolism just like the book of revelations..... if you have the eyes to see and the ears to hear.

[mwight]

Not everyone needs or wants a teacher to hold their hand. I believe a lot things can be learned on your own, if your a serious student.

 

My sister taught herself to be fluent in Japanese, and German, and art.

 

I taught myself to build computers, to run linux, basic electronics and soldering, to change my own oil, to wire my own house, do my own plumbing, I taught myself algebra, trig, and most of calculus in college, chemistry and physics too. I eventually plan on teaching myself to speak and read/write Chinese.

 

I think more than anything teachers serve as coaches to help people stay focused on learning. Most absolutely require that structure,

in order to learn, but others called autodidacts learn better on their own.

 

 

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Self-taught#Notable_autodidacts

Edited December 3, 2008 by mwight

[goldisheavy]

The parable's Jesus taught with contained Kabbalistic symbolism just like the book of revelations..... if you have the eyes to see and the ears to hear.

The problem is that Kabbala was and still is (even with the Rabi Laitman) a secret club. So it was an asshole thing to do to use the symbolism of a secret society like that. He should have sealed his disciples with his intent or much better, much better, he should have spoken using every day language and down to earth metaphors.

[Mal]

My sister taught herself to be fluent in Japanese, and German, and art.

 

hehe funny you should say that. I was going to say that I taught myself to say

"Good morning sir (or miss) do you speak English"

in Cantonese. But it's not a good example because while I have a beautifully correct and formal sounding voice (imagine someone talking English with a posh English accent) it did take me a few months to learn the pronunciation.

 

Thats the only thing I can say in Cantonese except for "Sorry I can't speak Cantonese I can only speak English" That one really amuses the Cantonese speakers

 

So I would have got better value for money not spending $$$ on that pimsleur course and just talking to a Cantonese speaker.

 

Basically I prefer to teach myself.... and currently I'm teaching others for a living too!

[h.uriahr]

mjjbecker quit making it like youre the only mopai student to grace this green earth. you and your teacher are jokes.

[SiliconValley]

love my neighbor as my self

 

Christianity has mostly been described as dualistic or non-advaitic. Does the above statement reflect that or does it suggest otherwise?

[r.w.smith]

mjjbecker quit making it like youre the only mopai student to grace this green earth. you and your teacher are jokes.

LOOOOOOOL

[mjjbecker]

..

Edited August 27, 2009 by mjjbecker