Ascended Masters

[Trunk]

There is a teaching ~ learning style where the teacher sits in front of the room and meditates, and the students meditate. There is a sort of osmosis, a natural body~to~body learning and - if the teacher is sufficiently advanced - the transformation of the students' bodies occurs quickly. It is both a matter of available pure energy (grace) and high level organization of form (being).

 

So, in that style of teaching ~ learning, the communication isn't conceptual - but is one of silent presence for the purpose of transformation. "Answering questions" is not what it's primarily about.

 

.. experiencing communication with ascended masters. ...

Does anyone have anymore info on this? Also, has anyone ever experienced anything regarding such?

This happens in most religions, imo, and ime the "communication" is as described above, not a "Q&A session". Christians experience this with Jesus, Hindus with various deities, etc. There are heavens and there are beings and humans have traditionally "blended their mind-streams" with these beneficial influences.

 

Not saying that Q&A never happens w/ people, but that it's more problematic and - imo - less to the point.

 

T

[Seth Ananda]

I have some experience in this area and many many theory's and as many questions.

 

I'm afraid that experiencing this realm in no way gives you certainty in your understanding of this realm and Often brings up more questions. But I'll share some experiences and perceptions about The other side, not just Ascended Masters, as I now tend to believe they are more similar than not...

 

I don't believe in Saint Germain one bit. I researched his life story (factual not channeled) and there is no way he Ascended anywhere but further into the cycle of Birth/death but that didn't stop the bastard standing behind me and Blasting the Shit out of me with his Violet flame which left me on my knees and free of years worth of precious baggage.

I still wont forgive him for that one!

 

I have had Many 'Strong' experiences of J.C. who I am not sure if even existed but who I cant help but think of with Great Love. Its irrational I know but I feel Him as clear as day and I get so much Motivation from his presence, For my own Spiritual work.

Also Babaji (of Yogananda lineage)

 

I Fired my guides years ago, and my Animal companions, in a fit of Spiritual Elitism, which was probably quite arrogant and I miss them sometimes. Especially the old gypsy woman.

 

 

Sai Baba, The Kiddie fiddling, cheap ring palming, Afro having Guru, helped me into the some of my early spiritual experiences, Grew Vabhuti all over his picture (except his eyes) each night, in the jar on our fridge, the ash which healed our Dogs eye which got cut open right through the Iris. There was not a scratch the next day on his eye. A female friend caught Half a jar of the ash falling out of her 3rd eye after a Sai visitation. He appeared in the middle of the road motioning my friends to pull over which they did and when they got out he was gone. they walked 20 feet round the sharp bend ahead and the road had collapsed down the cliff face it ran along. They would have gone straight over the Edge.

I dont At all believe Sai Baba is the genuine thing.

 

I met my Nanna after she passed away and she was So happy. No more aches and pains. when my Gramps passed on two weeks later Different story. He was freaking scared and unstable and it took several hours of Prayer/focus to help him center.

 

I believe Nanna and Gramps were real, not unconscious projections of my mind or creations of Believers within the Collective, but How do I know? I don't.

I Believe that St Germain and his friends are creations... but still real. But how do I know?

 

I certainly feel much more at home calling on Saints/Sages who were highly evolved. The Quality of their light feels different to mental creations and they give me well needed 'Nudges' at times. Invaluable.

 

It is My Theory that Spirit doesn't care what you believe in and will use any Image for the sacred you have in your mind as a Doorway to you. This for me explains Sai Baba and the other Dubious Miracle workers...

You could believe in a Coke can and It would probably start Appearing, surrounded by Healing Light.

 

Who knows? Thanks for putting up with this Ramble

 

Seth Ananda

[三江源]

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Edited December 14, 2015 by 三江源

[Mak_Tin_Si]

As my web said, my taoism branch of Chi in Nature is taught and passed on by ascended masters. Tey do not just come in when you are meditating, when you can open a channel with your power, you can actually see them in front of you too. But that only apply if you have the ability to see. Which needs training with the eye and attunement to see different dimensions. Because they are in another dimension whch can overlap ours. so we must be trained and attunned to be able to communicate with them.

 

 

I used to read about people experiencing communication with ascended masters. In fact, the grandmaster of a workshop i'd attended claims to have been taught by ascended masters during deep mediatation. At the time I was kinda "iffy" about the whole thing, but these days it seems more and more real to me and makes a case for what exactly can be derived from communication with ascended masters.

 

Does anyone have anymore info on this? Also, has anyone ever experienced anything regarding such?

[Trunk]

Interesting thread. I was thinking about how twice I have met teachers who have in their wake left a trail of spirits.. or to be clearer : teachers that I have met, after whom I have noticed spirits visiting me, checking me out, seeking to enlist me.

The "heavenly lineage" of an embodied teacher is a big deal. Gives the teacher enormous resivoirs of purity, depth, and stability as back-up and context. I think that a lot of the purpose of having a teacher in-the-flesh is to introduce you to your own relationship with that teacher's heavenly lineage. Once you get transmission from the teacher, you've been introduced to the lineage as well (whether you knew it or not).

 

My impression is that this kind of knowledge is just basic for some other cultures.

[三江源]

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Edited December 14, 2015 by 三江源

[Ya Mu]

The "heavenly lineage" of an embodied teacher is a big deal. Gives the teacher enormous resivoirs of purity, depth, and stability as back-up and context. I think that a lot of the purpose of having a teacher in-the-flesh is to introduce you to your own relationship with that teacher's heavenly lineage. Once you get transmission from the teacher, you've been introduced to the lineage as well (whether you knew it or not).

 

I'm glad to see this written. It seems there are many who do not understand how significant this is.

[goldisheavy]

The "heavenly lineage" of an embodied teacher is a big deal. Gives the teacher enormous resivoirs of purity, depth, and stability as back-up and context. I think that a lot of the purpose of having a teacher in-the-flesh is to introduce you to your own relationship with that teacher's heavenly lineage. Once you get transmission from the teacher, you've been introduced to the lineage as well (whether you knew it or not).

 

My impression is that this kind of knowledge is just basic for some other cultures.

 

Well said. What you are describing is a condition that empowers someone who has externalized authority and authenticity, which is most people.

 

Almost everyone, look around, what do they do when they are unsure? They consult others. Sometimes even ANY other person is better than oneself. Other times experts are sought after. If your car breaks, do you go to any random stranger? Do you do it yourself? Most likely not. You go to an expert. And how do you know the expert is not just some bullshitter? Well, if it's a car mechanic, it helps if they are dressed professionally, or if not, then they should be covered in grease. Then you watch how they make eye contact. Do they seem honest? Then the fact that they can afford to work in a big garage...so you are thinking, a fake couldn't last in a garage, right? So you look for buildings. You might look for certifications. How do you know those certifications mean anything? Well you don't know shit, but you hear others talk about them. You saw it on some web site. Then you saw something about it in a newspaper then your friend said something. So now you want a certified mechanic. This kind of behavior is normal for most humans (mortals).

 

People need context around the figure of authority in order to believe it. They can't believe it if it has no context. For example, if some random dude says something profound, you say, "oh that's clever" but no big deal. If someone sits on a glorious throne, surrounded by the pictures of the lineage masters, worshiped by the thousands and says EXACTLY the same thing, you go WOW!!! ZING!!! Spirits are flying... energy is zapping, miracles are happening, you name it.

 

Why?

 

It has to do with the beliefs. You simply can't conceive of having this power internally. You just can't hack it. Can't accept that YOU can be like 1000 ascended masters combined. It simply is not an option for you, that's what you believe. You believe you have to train. Etc. All that is contextualized too, so you can't just start believing you don't have to train, because the belief in the need for training comes from other beliefs which are supported by yet more other beliefs.... It's a network of beliefs. It's not just one belief in isolation that's blocking your power. It's the structure of the entire belief network that structures, constrains your expression (power).

 

So, on one hand, it's good to connect with the lineage, because you already believe lineages work when you go to a doctor, or when you get an "established" mechanic to fix your car, etc. It goes ALONG with your current belief structure.

 

However, a truly strong spiritual person will look beyond this. Instead of going along with the belief structure, this person will examine it and find that this structure, if followed, will NEVER dissolve, and will always yield misery. And further, the kind of power you get from it is always limited, because of the context. It is conditioned. In other words, if you trained and got power, as soon as you stop training, the power is gone. Or if you connect with the lineage to get the power, if the lineage no longer wants you, you lose it again. And there are many examples of cast outs. For example look at Gelugpas and Kadampas. If I remember correctly they were one lineage, but later they split and now there is a bitter feud, and as a result the power of both lineages have declined. Dalai Lama was supposedly even assaulted by the "evil" spirit from the "evil" New Kadampa tradition, etc.. and the "mighty" Dalai Lama was afraid, and that's why he wanted everyone to pray for the attacks to stop and to condemn the New Kadampa tradition and so on. The important thing to learn from this is that lineages are not good sources of power. Just like the university is not a good source of learning. Why not? Because what universities teach gets updated every year. So when you get your diploma, it begins to lose value as soon as you stop attending the university. But if you stay at the university and don't leave, you never get to actually apply your learning.

 

So you always deal with limitations. These secret power clubs always limit you. Once you assume the throne of a lineage, you are not high and mighty. You now have a job to uphold the stupid lineage. It's a JOB!

 

You know, all of you need to reach Zhuangzi (or Chuang Tzu). All of you. There is a chapter there about the Emperors trying to abdicate their throne to the sages. Every single time the sages decline. There is a reason for that. There is a great lesson in that. Learn that lesson. Understand it. Deeply. In your heart. Why do the greatest sages always decline the symbolic power spots? That's right, because their power is symbolic, and symbols have power only due to mind. But a sage controls his own mind and can withdraw power from any, ANY symbol, and give it to any other symbol. For example a sage can stand next to the highest lineage holder from any Daoist tradition and remove all his power. Then this guy cannot do any magic. It's very simple. In fact, if you read stories about Buddhas you will read about this. Other powerful beings lost their powers in the presence of Buddha. Why? Because Buddha understands the true scope of intent. Buddha's intent is infinite and Buddha doesn't have a limited identity. So there is no contravening power in the presence of a Buddha. The same is true for any sage, because basically "Buddha" is just a word. We are talking about highly realized beings.

 

No highly realized being ever got there from a lineage. They all either stood on their own two feet from the getgo, or they started with some lineage, but later became independent. The key is to get the PRINCIPLE. If you understand how power works, you no longer need to get more and more lessons or more and more training. Lessons and training stop. That's the path of "no more learning". But you will never understand the cause for the cessation of learning if you don't learn ON YOUR OWN. If you keep uncritically swallowing what you hear through your ears, it doesn't matter where you go. If you go in the world or if you go to a secret lineage, you will be cheated no matter what. What will cheat you is your own uncritical mind. Do you see?

 

In other words, if you say, "I don't believe in this expert, I will find a better expert" the pattern of expert-reliance is not broken. So just because you snob all the worldly experts and seek all the spiritual ones, you are still ensnared in a larger pattern of externalization of authority and authenticity.

 

Authority is power.

 

Authenticity is validity.

 

So if you externalize authority it means you get your power from someone else, from some organization, from some club, from lineage, from a university, from Deity, from spirits, from Coke can.

 

And if you externalize authenticity it means when you get an experience, you do not take it as real until it is verified and validated externally. So you see a vision and see your master and master says "This is not real", and you say, "yes sir". Or the master says, "This is real, keep practicing!" "YES SIR!" This is a pattern of externalizing authenticity.

 

A sage is someone who reverses both of these patterns. Put them on its head. Authority is reabsorbed. Authenticity is reabsorbed. After this you can still have friends and companions, but you can't have masters anymore. You will be your own master. And it doesn't mean you'll never make a mistake, but it means no one can fix your mistakes for you anymore. You will be in charge of your experiential domain. You will declare what is valid and what is not valid without consulting with anyone. You will perform actions without asking permission. That's what it means to be with internalizes authenticity and authority. In this condition, one feels no threat, because one's power source is internal and one's validity is also internal. Feeling no threat, there is no fear. Without fear there is no need to attack anyone or anything. Life becomes playful and NO ONE can abuse you, ever. Not even nature. Even natural phenomena begin to take orders from you. You can send hunger away with a glance from your eye. That's what lorldly power is like. It's not small, like sending a ray from your hand. It's when you can put the sun in your back pocket. And it is attainable, but you can't get this from a lineage, because the lineage is a context of servitude and dependence. There is no lineage that is a context of independence because independence means acting with the knowledge that the context is empty of substance. So the contexts are stripped from their power.

 

I hope this helps at least some of you, but I am certain I went over many heads here.

Edited December 3, 2008 by goldisheavy

[三江源]

~

Edited December 14, 2015 by 三江源

[Ian]

 

No highly realized being ever got there from a lineage. They all either stood on their own two feet from the getgo, or they started with some lineage, but later became independent. The key is to get the PRINCIPLE. If you understand how power works, you no longer need to get more and more lessons or more and more training. Lessons and training stop. That's the path of "no more learning". But you will never understand the cause for the cessation of learning if you don't learn ON YOUR OWN. If you keep uncritically swallowing what you hear through your ears, it doesn't matter where you go. If you go in the world or if you go to a secret lineage, you will be cheated no matter what. What will cheat you is your own uncritical mind. Do you see?

 

This is great, but, alas, I've learned it from you instead of figuring it out for myself. Whatever shall I do now?

 

Seriously though, I do wonder where "the getgo" can be located. Is it not feasible that those who appear completely independent, or achieve independence, previously spent long lives attached to lineages, feeling their way?

 

Anyway, thank you. You've articulated some stuff I've had brewing, and brought it forwards.

 

And .... just curious .... can you put the sun in your pocket?

[rex]

Once you get transmission from the teacher, you've been introduced to the lineage as well (whether you knew it or not).

I'm sure being connected to a lineage confers protection on a number of levels (assuming you don't make yourself impossible to guard that is).

[Starjumper]

I hope this helps at least some of you, but I am certain I went over many heads here.

 

The fact that you are creating distortions by the way you spin it did not go over my head at all, nor did the fact that you have a domineering nature go over my head.

 

A true master will teach you to become independent because they teach you the route to self reliance and to the formless, which is NOT the same as spontaneous movement.

 

The thing is, you need to know an ass ended master when you see one. kidding!

Edited December 4, 2008 by Starjumper7

[Starjumper]

The fact that you are creating distortions by the way you spin it did not go over my head at all, nor did the fact that you have a domineering nature go over my head.

 

In case that went over your head, Gold: it appears that you are the kind of teacher that you are warning us against, ROFL

[三江源]

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Edited December 14, 2015 by 三江源

[Starjumper]

~A practice I have begun lately is to do with the boundary between me and the world. The sense of self and other.

 

It is a practice during meditation of drawing into oneself that which one is giving power to. Experiencing the limitless of self, the one - ness.

 

There is both a sense of impertinence in imagining, say, Sri Yukteswar, inside me, and a deep sense of relief.

 

That sounds like an interesting practice, Cat. I think it's a good thing but first I would need to identify what I'm giving my power to, and nothing comes to mind although I'm sure I'm doing it.

 

Concerning impertinence, I can't see how that fits and wonder if you meant impermanence? I had to look it up and I can see how you possibly mean irrelevance but I can't make the other words fit.

 

Definition: 1: the quality or state of being impertinent: as a: irrelevance, inappropriateness b: incivility, insolence

 

There is a somewhat similar practice that was mentioned on my forum, which is dead now,and it goes something like this. If you breath in and out through your pituitary, after breathing in and out through your third eye and crown point, that it feels like your field of awareness or your 'self' is expanding.

[三江源]

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Edited December 14, 2015 by 三江源

[seadog]

Thanks for posting the portrait of Sri Yuktesewar,Cat.

He reminds me of something.

But I can't quite put my finger on what it is?

As though stareing into the face of someone or something you use to know

Long Ago.

 

Very powerful.

Do you know the name of the book he wrote?

[Starjumper]

mmm, yes, I meant impertinence.. another word for it would be 'presumptuous'. Here is Sri Yukteswar :

 

 

I dont know if you can tell from this picture... he was a person of immense wisdom and power.. and he is still around as an ascended master. He taught Paramahansa Yogananda, and had direct contact with Babaji. He wrote a book which has a transmission within it, if a person is open to receiving that.

 

So I could truthfully say that I give power to Sri Yukteswar, in my thinking and in my heart. Perhaps I have phrased that misleadingly. I dont mean that I 'contribute' or 'donate' power to him.. I mean that my mental construct of him is one which has been imbued with a great deal of power, by me.

 

And so instead of externalising that source of power, I take it within me, in the boundless space of me.

 

So, given that I respect him and so much, and revere him, I feel presumptuous in doing so.

 

But by doing so the construct of one's inner space changes.

 

Does that make more sense?

 

I've read about Sri Yukteswar, thanks for the picture. Oh yes, that makes a lot of sense, thanks for clarifying it for me. It was Babaji that I was demanding something of once, and I mean really demanded! The demand was that I wanted someone who had been injured on purpose by others to be healed. I finished my demand by saying (in my head) "Do it NOW!" and the answer came back instantly: "Do it yourSELF".

 

It turned out that the person in question was evil and deserved what he got. That was the first time I got an answer after thinking something, and it was a real eye opener in many ways. The thing is that I don't know if it was Babaji or my teacher or some other ass ended master/wise guy who couldn't resist making a comment.

 

I'm sorry to hear your forum is dead.. as a dodo, or just gone a bit quiet?

 

No sorrows, no problem, everything is fine as it is. It never really got off the ground, only a small number of people discussed things there, and only with either miss Meow or myself, and we gave up. At least I did, I can't speak for her, but I think it's gone the way of the dodo. It has a lot of good info on it, and it's much better organized and nicer looking than this place, but this is where the action is. I guess I'll leave it there because it wouldn't be right to delete all the info.

[三江源]

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Edited December 14, 2015 by 三江源

[goldisheavy]

So I could truthfully say that I give power to Sri Yukteswar, in my thinking and in my heart. Perhaps I have phrased that misleadingly. I dont mean that I 'contribute' or 'donate' power to him.. I mean that my mental construct of him is one which has been imbued with a great deal of power, by me.

 

And so instead of externalising that source of power, I take it within me, in the boundless space of me.

 

Ahhh.... this is music to my ears! Most excellent! I feel significantly better and relieved. I can also feel many Maras are becoming a little depressed now.

Edited December 5, 2008 by goldisheavy

[Pero]

Starjumper, what is in your avatar?

[Starjumper]

Starjumper, what is in your avatar?

 

It is of the Flaming Emperor.

 

It is of a statue in China which depicts a person who is credited with discovering/inventing herbal medicine and also of farming. Called either the Flaming Emperor, Yim Dai, or the Divine Farmer, Sun Nong. Here is some information about him:

 

The Divine Farmer

 

The Divine Farmer whipped myriads of plants with His reddish-brown whip(*), so that He understood the nature of all those plants, knew whether they are Average, Poisonous, Cold, or Warm (*), and knew their smells, flavors and classifications. According to these knowledge, myriads of crops were planted, therefore He is honored by the world as "The Divine Farmer".

 

(* It is said that "reddish-brown" means "tongue", thus "whipping the plants with His reddish-brown whip" means "tasting the plants with His tongue". The story of "The Divine Farmer tasted myriads of plants" is very famous. )

 

(* Average, Poisonous, Cold, and Warm: the different natures of medicinal materials, recognized by Chinese Medicinal System )

 

 

That particular picture appeals to me because of the physical condition, and what that physical condition says about the emotional condition it represents and it is a model for me. I like to be muscular and slender like him, but more importantly the posture can be said to be a regal posture, and I like to have a similar posture as well. In my cultivation I have come to understand the relationship between posture and attitude, and a regal posture is conducive to a very self confident attitude.

[mYTHmAKER]

It is of the Flaming Emperor.

 

It is of a statue in China which depicts a person who is credited with discovering/inventing herbal medicine and also of farming. Called either the Flaming Emperor, Yim Dai, or the Divine Farmer, Sun Nong. Here is some information about him:

 

The Divine Farmer

 

The Divine Farmer whipped myriads of plants with His reddish-brown whip(*), so that He understood the nature of all those plants, knew whether they are Average, Poisonous, Cold, or Warm (*), and knew their smells, flavors and classifications. According to these knowledge, myriads of crops were planted, therefore He is honored by the world as "The Divine Farmer".

 

(* It is said that "reddish-brown" means "tongue", thus "whipping the plants with His reddish-brown whip" means "tasting the plants with His tongue". The story of "The Divine Farmer tasted myriads of plants" is very famous. )

 

(* Average, Poisonous, Cold, and Warm: the different natures of medicinal materials, recognized by Chinese Medicinal System )

That particular picture appeals to me because of the physical condition, and what that physical condition says about the emotional condition it represents and it is a model for me. I like to be muscular and slender like him, but more importantly the posture can be said to be a regal posture, and I like to have a similar posture as well. In my cultivation I have come to understand the relationship between posture and attitude, and a regal posture is conducive to a very self confident attitude.

 

And of course you look like him.

[三江源]

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Edited March 10, 2016 by 三江源

[Starjumper]

Hair gel, eeiwww.

 

And of course you look like him.

 

Whoever made that statue is a real master of the Way and he has produced a masterful depiction of a Taoist wizard, and so yes, I look like him, in my dreams, but I have discovered which one of the Taoist practices creates high cheekbones, also, I do like my herbs =)

 

When I become an old fart maybe I'll let my beard grow out and then I'll look even more like him. Wait! I already am an old fart. There's no sign of the horns - yet. I don't know the significance of the headgear. In some paintings he is depicted with fleshy knobs on his head, but I like the way the horns upset Christians (thumbs up emoticon goes here)

 

Edited December 5, 2008 by Starjumper7