My Behavior (input needed)

[Long Yun]

Ok, hello again everyone. It's been a very long time since I've posted, so I thought I'd say hello again. Anyway, here's my scenario:

 

I live in a dormitory in a town with a rampant feral cat problem. I was walking back to my room from my workout, and I saw an average sized, dark speckaled cat in the courtyard. It was looking for food, and it's getting quite cold as of late. It had a limp and was holding its hind leg up. I took pity on the thing. I took a can of Vienna Sausages (about the only thing I have to eat that I thought a cat might like) and took it outside to an area not too far from where the cat was. I didn't take it directly to the cat because I didn't want to scare him off. My hope is that he can smell it and he goes and gets it.

 

Now, here's my problem:

 

I think that charity in any form is a good thing, and compassion towards other creatures is a must for Buddhists. But was what I did very Taoist? Was I following the Tao? Was I letting the universe take it's course, or was I acting against the flow? I put the food where he could find it, but I didn't give it directly to him. This way, if he's meant to find food, he will. If he's not meant to, he won't. But I feel like this is a poor example of myself "acting effortlessly."

 

What do you guys think? And sorry for the lengthy post.

[Tao99]

Ok, hello again everyone. It's been a very long time since I've posted, so I thought I'd say hello again. Anyway, here's my scenario:

 

I live in a dormitory in a town with a rampant feral cat problem. I was walking back to my room from my workout, and I saw an average sized, dark speckaled cat in the courtyard. It was looking for food, and it's getting quite cold as of late. It had a limp and was holding its hind leg up. I took pity on the thing. I took a can of Vienna Sausages (about the only thing I have to eat that I thought a cat might like) and took it outside to an area not too far from where the cat was. I didn't take it directly to the cat because I didn't want to scare him off. My hope is that he can smell it and he goes and gets it.

 

Now, here's my problem:

 

I think that charity in any form is a good thing, and compassion towards other creatures is a must for Buddhists. But was what I did very Taoist? Was I following the Tao? Was I letting the universe take it's course, or was I acting against the flow? I put the food where he could find it, but I didn't give it directly to him. This way, if he's meant to find food, he will. If he's not meant to, he won't. But I feel like this is a poor example of myself "acting effortlessly."

 

What do you guys think? And sorry for the lengthy post.

#42 of Tao Teh Ching, Chan translation:

 

"Tao produced the One. The One produced the two. The two produced the three. And the three produced the ten thousand things. The ten thousand things carry the yin and embrace the yang, and through the blending of the material force they achieve harmony. "

 

Did you help to achieve harmony if you were able to? Then you followed the Tao.

Edited December 2, 2008 by Tao99

[Gerard]

Do whatever comes from within your heart, as a compassionate being towards suffering.

[Long Yun]

#42 of Tao Teh Ching, Chan translation:

 

"Tao produced the One. The One produced the two. The two produced the three. And the three produced the ten thousand things. The ten thousand things carry the yin and embrace the yang, and through the blending of the material force they achieve harmony. "

 

Did you help to achieve harmony if you were able to? Then you followed the Tao.

I did what I felt was right. But how could I have "acted effortlessly" with this situation?

[Tao99]

I did what I felt was right. But how could I have "acted effortlessly" with this situation?

 

Hmm, good question. I'd say acting effortlessly would be without ego involvement - self satisfaction/self-reflection - without having to make yourself do it, without thoughts of having to do it for the merit, but simply feeling like doing it for the harmony whether or not anybody knows or there is any reward or recognition to be gained, and effortlessly flowing in the energy of the Tao without inner conflict, unnecessary thoughts, or unnecessary actions.

[Aetherous]

I did what I felt was right. But how could I have "acted effortlessly" with this situation?

 

You would've acted effortlessly if you had not wondered whether you were acting effortlessly or not.

[zanshin]

from Chapter 81 of of the Tao Te Ching

 

Sages do not accumulate

The more they assist others, the more they possess

The more they give to others, the more they gain

The Tao of heaven

Benefits and does not harm

The Tao of sages

Assists and does not contend

 

 

Compassion is one of the three treasures in Taoism, so I don't think it more of Buddhist virtue, so maybe you acted effortlessly at the time in feeling compassion and doing something to help.

 

So now I will tell I think it was very kind and a lovely thing to do to try to help the kitty- so probably not very Taoist to tell me about it

[picnic]

Was it the universe acting as one, through you? Or was it your separate ego acting?

 

Maybe the cat/universe limped to get the you/universe to act with pity and feed it as the cat/universe had some kitten/universe to feed at home and needed some more days in cat form before rejoining the tao. Or maybe your ego fed the cat to feel better about itself.. I'd go with the former

[Long Yun]

You would've acted effortlessly if you had not wondered whether you were acting effortlessly or not.

So I'm thinking too hard? I was just doing it for the sake of the poor little guy. I mean I'm not out for any personal reward. But I couldn't help think that I was acting out of my station. I won't lose sleep over it or anything

[goldisheavy]

But was what I did very Taoist? Was I following the Tao? Was I letting the universe take it's course, or was I acting against the flow?

 

The problem you are having is that you believe there is a specific shape that the flow has, and you either match that shape or you have a mismatch. However, by definition, everything flows within Tao. Nothing is outside Tao. Disharmony is a kind of harmony within Tao. For example, if you clap your hands, to someone who only sees hands and does not know that the hands could be attached to a person, it can look like the two hands are fighting. But if you know that both hands belong to the same person, the meaning changes from "hands fighting" to an "applause". Just one additional bit of information and the meaning can flip diametrically.

 

So are you happy with what you did or not? Have you investigated the matter in your own mind? That's more important than to solicit validation or invalidation from a forum. Of course it's good to accept input on your actions, but you don't have to confirm every itch with everyone around you. It is possible to make your own mistakes and take responsibility. After all the point is what? Why are you asking? You want to avoid making a mistake, right? Why not embrace the mistakes instead? Mistakes will sometimes happen. You learn and move on. But it is insane to try to prevent all mistakes. Mistakes are part of Tao. Uncertainty is part of Tao. There is that which is clearly defined and that which is not. Not all movement within Tao is straightforward. There is some aspects of order and some aspects of chaos, but Tao is beyond order and chaos -- it is not limited by these concepts.

 

If you understand what the flow is, you understand there is no way you can act against it, because your desires and intentions are part of the flow and not something outside. Being stupid and making mistakes is part of the flow. Correcting oneself and learning is also part of the flow. Nothing is outside.

[rain]

Thanks for the question and the scenario. These days I seem to be very aware of when my heart is stirring.

Even when I look at my master and feel how it vibrates and activates I notice a feeling that very closely resembles pity, but it is passionate compassion and includes also myself and life in it's whole in the same moment. So when this is activated..there is no either or, good or bad..you see the ultimate spirit alongside with the vulnerable withering appearance and your insight overflowes..and will be received where needed, not necessarily for you to harvest any particular outcome. Be a cat, yourself, the master, a beggar or a friend.

Edited December 2, 2008 by rain

[Ian]

The problem you are having is that you believe there is a specific shape that the flow has, and you either match that shape or you have a mismatch. However, by definition, everything flows within Tao. Nothing is outside Tao. Disharmony is a kind of harmony within Tao. For example, if you clap your hands, to someone who only sees hands and does not know that the hands could be attached to a person, it can look like the two hands are fighting. But if you know that both hands belong to the same person, the meaning changes from "hands fighting" to an "applause". Just one additional bit of information and the meaning can flip diametrically.

 

So are you happy with what you did or not? Have you investigated the matter in your own mind? That's more important than to solicit validation or invalidation from a forum. Of course it's good to accept input on your actions, but you don't have to confirm every itch with everyone around you. It is possible to make your own mistakes and take responsibility. After all the point is what? Why are you asking? You want to avoid making a mistake, right? Why not embrace the mistakes instead? Mistakes will sometimes happen. You learn and move on. But it is insane to try to prevent all mistakes. Mistakes are part of Tao. Uncertainty is part of Tao. There is that which is clearly defined and that which is not. Not all movement within Tao is straightforward. There is some aspects of order and some aspects of chaos, but Tao is beyond order and chaos -- it is not limited by these concepts.

 

If you understand what the flow is, you understand there is no way you can act against it, because your desires and intentions are part of the flow and not something outside. Being stupid and making mistakes is part of the flow. Correcting oneself and learning is also part of the flow. Nothing is outside.

 

Not arguing with any of this. But would like to add that on a local scale, some situations can be so disharmonious that they get splatted, as part of the maintenance of overall harmony. And if you are part of what gets splatted, then you will need to have really internalised the above perspective or you will get upset.

 

So...even while you can't act against the overall flow, there's no harm at all in being locally harmonious. It's just very hard to get there by trying...

[Long Yun]

The problem you are having is that you believe there is a specific shape that the flow has, and you either match that shape or you have a mismatch. However, by definition, everything flows within Tao. Nothing is outside Tao. Disharmony is a kind of harmony within Tao. For example, if you clap your hands, to someone who only sees hands and does not know that the hands could be attached to a person, it can look like the two hands are fighting. But if you know that both hands belong to the same person, the meaning changes from "hands fighting" to an "applause". Just one additional bit of information and the meaning can flip diametrically.

 

So are you happy with what you did or not? Have you investigated the matter in your own mind? That's more important than to solicit validation or invalidation from a forum. Of course it's good to accept input on your actions, but you don't have to confirm every itch with everyone around you. It is possible to make your own mistakes and take responsibility. After all the point is what? Why are you asking? You want to avoid making a mistake, right? Why not embrace the mistakes instead? Mistakes will sometimes happen. You learn and move on. But it is insane to try to prevent all mistakes. Mistakes are part of Tao. Uncertainty is part of Tao. There is that which is clearly defined and that which is not. Not all movement within Tao is straightforward. There is some aspects of order and some aspects of chaos, but Tao is beyond order and chaos -- it is not limited by these concepts.

 

If you understand what the flow is, you understand there is no way you can act against it, because your desires and intentions are part of the flow and not something outside. Being stupid and making mistakes is part of the flow. Correcting oneself and learning is also part of the flow. Nothing is outside.

Very very true. I like this post. By the way, I'm not after validation, I just wanted to pose what I thought was a decent philosophical question. I went with my gut and feel good about it, but I thought I'd get some input as to how "Taoist" my actions were. Thanks very much!