VCraigP Posted December 29, 2008 Word. It's pseudo-rationality. Grow up or die. Go straight to the point. When groups believe in and even long for Armegeddon this is not rational, it is not productive, it is not healthy and it diminishes or eliminates these groups efforts to improve and strive for a better world in this life, in this time. Look, if extremist Muslims, Christians and Jews are all expecting and longing for the END TIMES is this a GOOD THING? This question has nothing to do with whether or not certain people may have their lives improved by adherence to faith and spiritual awakening through religion (as dubious as that sounds to my ears). This has everything to do with understanding the world view of an organization to which people belong. I agree with Bill Maher. IF you belong to an organization with the expressed world view that the end times are here and we should rejoice and allow/assist this to happen, then you have a choice to make. Is that an acceptable world view to you? Will you distance yourself from such insanity? The problem with FAITH is that you would never ask the above question because faith is blind and you have tied your wagon to the Church leaders. Faith and rationality are in opposition to each other. THis is what extremism is. It doesn't matter how those in question arrived at this extremism, through whatever geopolitical inequity, the fact is that they have arrived at this place where Jihad, Rapture, etc is part and parcel of their worldview. It is Psychosis. It is difficult to wrap your head around just what extremism is, because I think the vast majority here on TTB are quite rational in relative terms. ...I lost my train of thought and didn't finish this post before walking away. FWIW Craig Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Aetherous Posted December 29, 2008 VCraigP, I agree with your point of view, actually. 100%. I've experienced a lot of extremism first hand, and of course I don't like it. But I think that Bill Maher takes it way too far and becomes extremist, himself. "Plain fact is religion must die, for mankind to live." That's not true. It's not actually rational to say so (in the 'logically sound' sense). Religion has gone on for many years, and actually mankind has flourished lately. We're lucky it has, because now we have many people who question the insane things that the extremists have done in the name of their religions. Now we think more clearly, and have societies which aren't bound as much to the church, so people can speak freely. This is all great, and we're at a critical turning point in human history. From my point of view (arguing against the death of all religion): I am not saying blind faith is needed, and that truly questioning is the opposite of faith. I'm just saying there's something to many religions that's true and great, and to want to kill the whole of religion just because things can get taken too far, is too extreme for my taste. A little faith is not horrible. For instance, I believe in God and it does take some faith. My faith hurts no one. You can have faith and also question. Denial of one of the two is the root of extremism. We truly can have both. You can have faith and NOT believe in an apocalypse and base your actions around it. In order for this website to exist, and for us to learn the things we do, religion had to exist. I am thankful for it! Because I've found a great peace in my heart. Without religion, that wouldn't have happened and I would've just focused on more mundane things. Religion has truly improved my life (so has reason). The purpose of religion is to be loving and kind towards others, and to have an enjoyable life. The purpose of Maher's argument is that religion makes people nuts, so they're incapable of being loving and kind towards others, and having an enjoyable life. The two goals are the exact same: to be loving and kind, and enjoy life. Right? Also...it's a good question to ask yourself when you're discussing this topic: am I being loving and kind, and enjoying my life? Or is anger taking over, and is life not so beautiful? Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
thelerner Posted December 29, 2008 I believe, everyone should believe what I believe. Whether its within religion or its against religion - THAT belief is the poison that starts the shit rolling. Michael Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Aetherous Posted December 29, 2008 I believe,everyone should believe what I believe. Whether its within religion or its against religion - THAT belief is the poison that starts the shit rolling. Good observation. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Stigweard Posted December 29, 2008 I believe, everyone should believe what I believe. Whether its within religion or its against religion - THAT belief is the poison that starts the shit rolling. Michael I believe I believe what you believe. ;p Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
