How many Kunlun workshops?

[Cameron]

Nothing to see here

Edited February 3, 2009 by Cameron

[Spectrum]

I really got it that this wasn't just a practice but a family.

 

 

maybe you only really need to see Max once to get Golden Dragon Body. Who knows, maybe that is correct.

 

 

But how could Max possibly know that ALL of his students only need to see him or only should see him once? Did Chris, Kan, Rich, Diana, Eileen, Damiano, Oscar etc only see Max once? Obviously they have seen him many,many times.

[mgd]

...

Edited April 13, 2009 by mgd

[bindo]

I'm with you Cameron. His false advertising argument is ridiculous. Maybe the stupidest argument I've ever seen on TTB's.

[Aetherous]

Gloria,

 

I'm fine.

 

I'm not broken, so you don't have to fix me.

 

I consider us to be friends...more like real friends and not the pay-for-time-with friends. We've shared stuff. So I will go out on a limb (at the risk of the branch breaking), and say what's on my mind about this...

 

It's not bad to be broken. In fact I think everyone is, and it's fun to try and put ourselves back together. It enriches our lives. So it's great to listen to suggestions from people that care for you. And I am pretty sure Cam is one of those people...I can feel it.

 

At times it's very hard to accept what other people see in you...for instance with myself, my mom keeps hinting that I should get married and meet a girl. Like every day, to the point where it exhausts me to be around her. But despite that being really kind of rude for her to do, she's right and it's helpful advice. I need to open myself to that area of my life more.

 

So someone that's trying to help you by giving their analysis on you, whether they're your friend or not, is a good thing.

 

And if you are truly letting things go, then it doesn't matter if people try to fix you. The correct response would be to radiate peace and say nothing...because is it so offensive if someone tries to extend a helping hand? Everyone's imperfect...but at least they're trying to do something good based on their limited perspective. Right?

 

When I said before that "our opinions reveal our faults to everyone", I meant that when you react so strongly to someone saying something about you, it shows how much you haven't let go of anything. It's very clear to anyone reading what you type, that there are still some very big issues.

 

I'm a work in progress...I didn't get help on the Kunlun site...Boo Hoo call an WAAambulance....who cares...I got my happy ending, relied on ME and was divinely directed to what I needed.

 

Focus on you.

 

BE SUPREMELY SELFISH. YOU ARE HERE FOR YOU, NOT FOR ME.

 

YOU HAVE TO BE OKAY FIRST BEFORE YOU CAN HELP SOMEONE ELSE.

 

I just have to point out how hypocritical it is, to say "don't help me because you're not qualified; now here is some advice for you..." Also, you're attempting to change the way Cam is. If you were only focusing on yourself and not others, you wouldn't feel the need to do that.

 

Taking our own advice is tough, and I rarely do it...but it's something that's good to be aware of, so that we might be able to do it more. It'll be good for us.

 

AND NORMALLY THE RULE IS...AND THIS IS MAX'S RULE - THE PERSON HAS TO CROSS YOUR PATH AND ASK FOR HELP. AND THEN YOU HAVE TO WEIGHT IT IN YOUR HEART AND GUT AND REALLY REFLECT IF YOU ARE THE PERSON TO HELP THEM...BECAUSE YOU KNOW NOTHING ABOUT THEM AND HAVEN'T A CLUE WHAT THEY REALLY NEED.

 

That being said, were you right in giving Cameron the advice you just gave? I mean, did he ask for your help? Did you weigh it in your heart and gut whether you could actually be the person who should be trying to help him with his issues? If not...then in taking your own advice, it would've been best to have just left it alone, because he isn't broken and doesn't need the WAAambulance.

 

Seriously, accepting constructive criticism is hard sometimes...especially when it's hitting that sore spot in your heart. And saying this in a public forum is hard, too...because I know you'll be mad and it'll risk our friendship. But what else can a true friend do, except call you out on your BS? Who else could possibly do it?

 

Hopefully we can laugh about it soon enough.

[mgd]

...

Edited April 13, 2009 by mgd

[Aetherous]

I know I'm full of it.

 

I look forward to that day as well.

[rain]

may I join?

[mentalground0]

my mom keeps hinting that I should get married and meet a girl.

 

and that's exactly the order it happens in

[Sloppy Zhang]

I'm with you Cameron. His false advertising argument is ridiculous. Maybe the stupidest argument I've ever seen on TTB's.

 

Sheesh guys, all I said was that the claim can be misleading suddenly it's evolved to "false advertising", what is it going to evolve into next? "scam artistry"? Let's all breathe and take a step back

 

The advertisement says come to one workshop, get the transmission, then cultivate. So if someone goes to one workshop, gets the transmission, cultivates.... but then stuff gets messed up, and asked for help, the response is, "a diligent student would have made the effort to....."

 

So then what's the definition of diligent? Someone who goes to more than one seminar? According to what standard? Because, you know, the advertising says "one seminar", so if you are saying a diligent student would come to more than one, well, that means everyone who comes to one seminar is not a diligent student! Even though "all you need is one seminar".

 

Furthermore, I don't like how people say, "would have made the effort to...." followed by "show up to another seminar" or "meet people in person" yadda yadda. I don't know about you guys, but times are tight. Not everyone has the money to go gallivanting across the country from Arizona to NJ to Colorado to wherever to get their questions answered or to get more face time. Maybe they show their diligence by self practice, because, you know, they showed up to the one seminar and got the one transmission which, according to all the official pages, is all you need.

 

Then when you seek other avenues for support because you don't have the time or money to go skipping across the country, people are like, "well a more diligent student would have made the effort to seek help in person at a seminar." That's insulting, I mean, really. I don't know Gloria's situation, but for me, I'm a college student, money is tight, I gotta work hard to keep it together as it is. If I drop hundreds of bucks to pay for a seminar + travel to a seminar, that may very well be the one seminar I can attend for a LONG time. And if I have a problem, and ask for help, you know how it would feel to be told, "well a more diligent student would have made an effort to come to more seminars and ask questions in person like they should"? It would suck and I'd be pretty pissed off. But I guess Gloria is a much better person than me so we'll leave it there

 

If you're going to be telling people that, then seriously, you should take down the "one seminar" claim. Read those last couple paragraphs a few times before responding, and really try to put yourself in their situation. Cultivation is important, yes, but sometimes you can't always drop everything else and dedicate yourself to cultivation. As much as many of us would like to do that, you just can't. So who's the more diligent student? The one who faithfully attends any and all seminars or the person who gives up the seminars and practices alone so they can keep life going for others?

 

Really.

 

[edit]

 

And again guys, I'm not blasting Kunlun or the practice and whatnot. It's not about whether the practice works or not, there are plenty of people that can attest to it. It's just being represented in a horrible way (speaking as someone who got interested in it, went to the website, then came here and read all the past conversations and found the info here presents it in a totally different light than the website). You've got one source saying one thing, then you've got other people going, "oh well REALLY you need to be doing this INSTEAD" when the vast majority of people probably only have access to that first source (unless there's a link to the tao bums on the kunlun website so they can see all this discussion )

 

If one seminar just isn't gonna cut it for most people, why is that claim even up there??????

Edited February 1, 2009 by Sloppy Zhang

[Aetherous]

and that's exactly the order it happens in

 

Seems so.

 

I don't know Gloria's situation, but for me, I'm a college student, money is tight, I gotta work hard to keep it together as it is. If I drop hundreds of bucks to pay for a seminar + travel to a seminar, that may very well be the one seminar I can attend for a LONG time.

 

I'm in the same boat. By the time I make it to the next workshop, which will hopefully happen in May, it will have been a whole year. If you decide to go, make it to that one...a lot of good bums go to the NJ ones. We can help eachother out with expenses (more people going in on a hotel room is very helpful).

 

These are very powerful practices that sometimes may require some help. For instance, if I practice level one for a few days, I start getting in bad shape health wise. Without anyone helping me, I will either hurt myself attempting to push through it, or stop practicing the 3 levels from the book. I need some real advice on how I can continue.

 

Everyone is led from within on the best course of action, but that's no substitute for getting help directly from someone who has tons of experience. Max might simply say, "Be celibate" and that would solve my problems. Who knows! So...having a guide can make it easier at times.

 

I think the reason why it was advertised that you only need to see Max once, is because the practices are so that you can do them on your own. You don't need to keep learning new things once you have the basics. Plus a lot of seekers rely way too much on their teachers, expecting them to do the whole path for them. So this way it's up to the practitioner to practice! Also, I think they never wanted it to be a follow-Max-around thing.

[mgd]

...

Edited April 13, 2009 by mgd

[rain]

[quote name='mgd' date

 

Here's the thing...most everyone had problems with the energy shooting into their heads during Kunlun and RP practice and needed help with grounding...not just me.

 

 

 

----------- really?

 

..how far away from your nose did you go to collect your truth?

[Ian]

I don't need this anymore...I want it because it's fast and fun and exciting and all my friends doing it....but I don't think I need it anymore, so I'm just going to do my best to settle into the peace and quiet I have with my practice now.

 

mmmm

[Smile]

QUOTE(Scotty @ Feb 1 2009, 12:31 PM)

my mom keeps hinting that I should get married and meet a girl.

 

mentalground0 (Posted Today, 01:55 PM) and that's exactly the order it happens in

This is the reason I come to this forum...

[Spirit Ape]

Edited February 1, 2009 by Spirit Ape

[Cameron]

edit

Edited February 3, 2009 by Cameron

[farmerjoe]

Gloria,

I consider us to be friends...more like real friends and not the pay-for-time-with friends. We've shared stuff. So I will go out on a limb (at the risk of the branch breaking), and say what's on my mind about this...

 

It's not bad to be broken. In fact I think everyone is, and it's fun to try and put ourselves back together. It enriches our lives. So it's great to listen to suggestions from people that care for you. And I am pretty sure Cam is one of those people...I can feel it.

 

At times it's very hard to accept what other people see in you...for instance with myself, my mom keeps hinting that I should get married and meet a girl. Like every day, to the point where it exhausts me to be around her. But despite that being really kind of rude for her to do, she's right and it's helpful advice. I need to open myself to that area of my life more.

 

So someone that's trying to help you by giving their analysis on you, whether they're your friend or not, is a good thing.

 

And if you are truly letting things go, then it doesn't matter if people try to fix you. The correct response would be to radiate peace and say nothing...because is it so offensive if someone tries to extend a helping hand? Everyone's imperfect...but at least they're trying to do something good based on their limited perspective. Right?

 

When I said before that "our opinions reveal our faults to everyone", I meant that when you react so strongly to someone saying something about you, it shows how much you haven't let go of anything. It's very clear to anyone reading what you type, that there are still some very big issues.

I just have to point out how hypocritical it is, to say "don't help me because you're not qualified; now here is some advice for you..." Also, you're attempting to change the way Cam is. If you were only focusing on yourself and not others, you wouldn't feel the need to do that.

 

Taking our own advice is tough, and I rarely do it...but it's something that's good to be aware of, so that we might be able to do it more. It'll be good for us.

That being said, were you right in giving Cameron the advice you just gave? I mean, did he ask for your help? Did you weigh it in your heart and gut whether you could actually be the person who should be trying to help him with his issues? If not...then in taking your own advice, it would've been best to have just left it alone, because he isn't broken and doesn't need the WAAambulance.

 

Seriously, accepting constructive criticism is hard sometimes...especially when it's hitting that sore spot in your heart. And saying this in a public forum is hard, too...because I know you'll be mad and it'll risk our friendship. But what else can a true friend do, except call you out on your BS? Who else could possibly do it?

 

Hopefully we can laugh about it soon enough.

 

Your post to me is the definiton of the Tao Bum Know It All. You got in the middle of your two friends working something out and you presensted your views in an arrogant and condescending way. A good friend would have stayed out of it. Joe.

Edited February 2, 2009 by farmerjoe

[Aetherous]

Yeah, sometimes I don't know how to treat friends well. You're right.

[Sloppy Zhang]

Your post to me is the definiton of the Tao Bum Know It All. You got in the middle of your two friends working something out and you presensted your views in an arrogant and condescending way. A good friend would have stayed out of it. Joe.

 

And then you got in the middle of two people working something out and you presented your views in an arrogant and condescending way.

 

Now I'm involved between you and them and I'm presenting my views in an arrogant and condescending way so now... um....

 

 

As a forum I think it goes without saying that people are allowed to post their opinions, and that conversations like these are out there for the world to see, and naturally people are going to respond and again it goes without saying that the posts mostly reflect personal opinion. In my humble opinion it's totally okay to voice your opinion and respond to things, it's part of being in a forum, but then to turn around and start judging peoples' opinions and stuff.... I dunno, it doesn't make sense given that it's a forum anyway

Edited February 2, 2009 by Sloppy Zhang

[farmerjoe]

In my humble opinion it's totally okay to voice your opinion and respond to things, it's part of being in a forum, but then to turn around and start judging peoples' opinions and stuff.... I dunno, it doesn't make sense given that it's a forum anyway

 

What I was trying to say but you said it better. Joe.

[mgd]

...

Edited April 13, 2009 by mgd

[Cameron]

Well I wish you the best in any case.

 

I'll still pop in here from time to time but will keep Kunlun discussions in the Kunlun Forum from now on.

 

I think I have said enough on this subject and if people are interested they can explore it, read the book, do the lecture.

 

Enjoy your practice

 

ps. Scott is a good guy and he is also my friend. He is also a youngster in his early 20's.

 

My God if you knew what sort of arguments and conversations I had with "online Taoists" in my early 20's Scott is an angel in comparison

 

Just ask old timers like Smile or Yoda. As a group we are doing pretty good I think.

 

And I think something Max said to me once applies. Let's not be so hard on ourselves. We are all on the path after all. We make mistakes. We learn hopefully we grow.

 

We hurt friends we help friends too and learn about ourselves. Hopefully we get better. I am happy you are doing well.

Edited February 2, 2009 by Cameron

[Aetherous]

I don't know...I kind of want to get feedback from everyone if they care to take the time...

 

Is what I said really that offensive?

 

I'm asking honestly because in the past I've had trouble with friendships. Not knowing where the boundaries are. I'd like to improve.

 

Should I not call my friends out if they're being hypocritical? If it's okay to do it, then did I do it in a bad way? I was honestly trying to be nice about it...and I guess it came off arrogant and condescending...but how else could I have said it, if such a thing is allowed to be said between friends?

[thelerner]

I don't know...I kind of want to get feedback from everyone if they care to take the time...

 

Is what I said really that offensive?

 

I'm asking honestly because in the past I've had trouble with friendships. Not knowing where the boundaries are. I'd like to improve.

 

Feedback is important. Personally I didn't find your comments offense or arrogant and I know they weren't meant to be. Its the nature of the forum that we cant' hear the love and concern in your 'voice' as you type, thus mis-reading .

 

Our friends keep us sane. They provide checks and balance for us. We need their input and criticisms, thats half there job (maybe a third). Its the imperfect nature of the forum that keeps us from being able to ask and feel out a problem like we would in real life over a beer.

 

The best we can we do is say sorry I was trying to help , and go on to our next mistake, cause thats life.

 

Michael