Sifu Jenny Lamb on learning Kunlun

[Cameron]

Here is Sifu Jenny's reply to my question regarding if people should practice from the book alone. It certainly isn't up to me or Sifu Jenny or Max to tell anyone what to do. I asked Jenny to let me post it here so other's could read her view on learning Kunlun. Please realize I consider myself a total beginner. And am basically putting this up for other beginner practitioners.

 

Dear Cameron,

 

Thank you for your kindness and wanting to share your thoughts with others on Kunlun practice in the Taobums forum. I do not have time to get involved with people's discussion on Kunlun practice. I only taught to a very limited group of people for the Spontaneous Adjustment Qigong, which is now worldwide known as Kunlun practice level one. If I am wrong, please correct me.

 

I shared my knowledge and experience with those who come to me for knowledge. I did not write a book about this practice. As you asked about whether people should just to learn the practice from the book of Kunlun, I sincerely suggested that those who are interested in learning Kunlun practice, go to Max, who wrote the book. I do not suggest that people starting Kunlun practice from the beginning with the book alone. The reason is simple, as a beginner you need a proper guide. A good teacher can benefit you in many ways, such as clear your doubts, answer your questions and correct your movements, and so forth.

 

Each individual is different. A good doctor will not prescribe the same medicine for all of his or her patients, no matter how good the medicine is. I cannot urge anyone enough to consult with your teacher, whoever taught you, whether in person or the book. Kunlun practice is a formless form, itself evolving. Letting an experienced teacher guide you is necessary. It can help you to reach your goal of self-healing, self-discovery and self-realization faster. You do not need to rely on your teacher all the time. It is your own journey. A teacher can merely point a direction. The path is yours. It is under your own feet. Only you can make a difference. Good luck with the practice.

 

Sincerely yours,

 

Jenny Lamb

[sahaj]

Great advice if you have access to a live teacher. Unfortunately at this point the book is the only option for me, living in Australia. From my limited practice from the book, it is a very powerful and profound practice, and I am very concerned not having a teacher to guide me, but what the hell I'll give it a go anyway and see where it goes! I can see if I didn't have a foundation in energy work this practice would raise alot of questions for me and possibly be harmful due my lack of understanding of the process. This would be completely fear based, as I don't see that there can be any harm in going wild on a chair for an hour a day

Edited February 21, 2009 by sahaj

[Spectrum]

Thoughtful Remarks. Thanks Cam.

 

Where does Sifu Lamb say no filming?

 

Spontaneous Adjustment Qigong, which is now worldwide known as Kunlun practice level one.

 

A variety of animals grooming themselves around the water hole. Picking, Kneeding, Brushing, Stretching, Combing, Rustling, Ruffling, Shaking and Settling...

Edited February 21, 2009 by Spectrum

[Spirit Ape]

Cause all you would get is people screaming, crying, laughing and getting stuck to fences and tennis courts and that isnt a good look for someone just starting or wanting to start. Can you imagine a kid asking his mother pointing at a youtube clip i want to do what they are doing she would send the kid to mental health! hahahaha

[farmerjoe]

I only taught to a very limited group of people for the Spontaneous Adjustment Qigong, which is now worldwide known as Kunlun practice level one. If I am wrong, please correct me.

 

I would like to know what Jenny's views are regarding those that learn the Kunlun practice then teach it to others. It seems to me that Jenny is saying that you should go to the teacher that you learned the practice from. What if the teacher you learn it from has no real experience with the practice or teaching and are new to both, what kind of direction would they be able to offer someone? Joe.

 

 

 

Cause all you would get is people screaming, crying, laughing and getting stuck to fences and tennis courts and that isnt a good look for someone just starting or wanting to start. Can you imagine a kid asking his mother pointing at a youtube clip i want to do what they are doing she would send the kid to mental health! hahahaha

 

How often has that happened people getting stuck to fences etc? All that might have happened with Kunlun but it doesn't seem to be the same practice with the quiet way Sufi Lamb has been teaching it. When I practice I find a private spot. No point in being seen and having to worry my mom about it. Maybe that day will come but if she gets exposed to it I think I'd do better introducing her to Sifu Lamb's way of presenting the practice where the focus seems to be about getting healthy. I don't think my mom would worry about my mental health then. Joe.

Edited February 21, 2009 by farmerjoe

[Loke]

H...

 

Jenny Lamb

 

If I dont have a good doctor then I go to a bad doctor if I dont have a doctor at all then I die. If I only have access to a bad doctor shall I then die and hope to get a good doctor in my next life?

[goldisheavy]

There are two kinds of teaching. Teaching the principles and teaching the details.

 

If you teach the principles, you can leave the details up to the student and you don't need to check them or verify them and so forth. This can be done with a book, and in my opinion, is by far the most useful thing to learn. The reason for this is because the principles are something that's universally applicable and they allow you to work with any manner of forms.

 

On the other hand, if you teach the person some details, which is to say, you teach them something concrete with a definite form, there is no way to know if the person is getting the form just right, or if the person is getting all the details just right from a book. This is when you need a teacher who has mastered the details to verify that you are executing all the concrete details correctly. This level of teaching is problematic, because it's never universally applicable. It doesn't work in all contexts. For example, if you learn a chakra system, can you help a horse? How about an octopus? I think the answer is obvious: no way. That's because the chakras are not a universal principles, but rather some details that emanate from a particular system. For example, if you read Castaneda's books, you find out they don't even see any chakras, but see these energy compartments. But what's interesting, is that they don't teach that those are predetermined. Some people have 3 compartments and others have 4, and if the yaqui sorcerer looked at an octopus, they might see something completely different. This is a little better than a chakra system in that it's not predefined in advance, but it is still something that's detail oriented and requires a teacher to master. It's something that works with concrete elements of experience.

 

So, the principles are abstract. The details are concrete. The details are an inferior teaching, because they are always context sensitive. That is to say, they apply only at a certain time, to certain people, to certain environments and cannot necessarily be always duplicated or be always meaningful. Principles on the other hand have wider applicability.

 

But the problem with principles and the reason people don't like to learn them is because the principles are abstract. They are intangible. And people like the instant gratification of tangible results. People want to learn something they can feel right away. Further, when you learn a principle, you become responsible for implementing it. And people don't like to be responsible. People like the idea that someone senior to them can make it all better and fix all their problems. That's comforting. But that's also very inconvenient, and in the long term, it is very harmful because it sets up a wrong kind of relationship between people: leaders and followers. Followers are by their very nature uncritical, and thus, mindless.

 

Learn from everything, follow nothing -- this is a slow, and in the short term possibility impractical process, but healthy in the long term mind habit to learn.

 

Follow everything, and as a consequence, learn nothing -- this is a process that sometimes gives quick and even useful results, but long term sets up a deadly habit that will bring about your downfall as you descend into a state of mindless reflexivity, stupor and slavery to phenomenal appearances.

 

If you are careful, you can combine the two approaches, but this carefulness can only be maintained if you take the learn from everything and follow nothing as your dominant approach. If the tendency to follow is dominating, eventually your care will dissipate until strong pain forces a re-evaluation.

[farmerjoe]

There are two kinds of teaching. Teaching the principles and teaching the details.

 

Thanks for this. Joe.

[Cameron]

Good stuff.

 

I don't have an opinion about whether you should or shouldn't just practice from Max's book alone. I just thought it might be nice for you all to have Sifu Jenny's perspective is all.

 

Please also understand Max has his own understanding which may be different than Sifu Jenny. I can't say one is "right" or "wrong" they both have a lifetime of practice and experience and there own perspective. In any case my guess is if anyone does practice from the book alone and has a positive experience they would probably make the effort to see Max or Jenny atleast once at some point.

 

Good luck in your practice.

Edited February 21, 2009 by Cameron

[padge]

Great advice if you have access to a live teacher. Unfortunately at this point the book is the only option for me, living in Australia. From my limited practice from the book, it is a very powerful and profound practice, and I am very concerned not having a teacher to guide me, but what the hell I'll give it a go anyway and see where it goes! I can see if I didn't have a foundation in energy work this practice would raise alot of questions for me and possibly be harmful due my lack of understanding of the process. This would be completely fear based, as I don't see that there can be any harm in going wild on a chair for an hour a day

 

The book is only an option for me as well since I live in Canada. I don't have any experience with energy work though, which is one of the reasons why I am taking it pretty slow with Kunlun. Do you have and books you would recommend to help me understand the process a bit more? I know the main idea is to let go, but there needs to be a certain level of understanding of the process to keep the fear away. Any suggestions?

 

Too bad we don't have access to the kunlunbliss forum.

Edited February 21, 2009 by padge

[Cameron]

My only advice is if you practice from the book make the effort to see Sifu Max or Sifu Jenny atleast once.

 

I cannot say one or the other both of them are awesome. To be honest I would have to say if possible see both. Do you think it is just an accident some of Max's top students were at Sifu Jenny's workshop? Of course not. Even it's true you only need to see Max one time which I can believe to me it's natural to want to see Sifu Jenny.

 

I feel a very strong connection with both Jenny and Max. even though they approach the practice somewhat differently they are both my teachers and in many ways complement eachother.

 

So save up. It looks like Max will be teaching for awhile in the United States. And if we are lucky Sifu Jenny would offer more workshops in the future although she is still very busy finishing up her PhD.

 

Cam

 

ps. Max has reccommended watching Ren and Stimpy videos if you have trouble getting your practice going. It's all about letting go and smiling

Edited February 22, 2009 by Cameron

[freeform]

padge, I have found books by Bradford Keeney very insightful. So far I enjoyed "Bushman Shaman" the most.

[rain]

yeah keep rolling those eyeballs

[padge]

My only advice is if you practice from the book make the effort to see Sifu Max or Sifu Jenny atleast once.

 

...

I will definitely try and see one of them. It doesn't look like they are coming to Canada any time soon so I'll have to make due for now.

 

 

padge, I have found books by Bradford Keeney very insightful. So far I enjoyed "Bushman Shaman" the most.

Thanks freeform I'll check it out.

[Aetherous]

Padge, fly to the east coast with me in May! I live in upper Michigan so no seminars come by me either. Still not 100% sure I'll be able to afford the trip yet, but we'll see.

 

...

 

About this topic: I went to a seminar last May and I've had minor health problems since then. So I do think the best thing would be continual face to face guidance if even just for assurance during rough times...but I think if you only have the book that's good enough. I mean it shows you how to do the practice just fine, but it will take some experimentation to navigate successfully. So it will just be a harder and longer path.

 

I might take my favorite Max quotes from the Kunlun forum and put them here for book practitioners to help out, since some of his sayings have been pretty helpful to me.

[Cameron]

Have fun at Max's workshop in May. Wish I could be there with you guys and gals. Those NJ workshops are awesome!!

 

edit-oops I mean they are going to Brooklyn this time. Nice!

Edited February 22, 2009 by Cameron

[padge]

Padge, fly to the east coast with me in May!

I'd love to go, but I doubt I'd be able to afford it and it doesn't look like they are taking any more registrations for that seminar!

 

I might take my favorite Max quotes from the Kunlun forum and put them here for book practitioners to help out, since some of his sayings have been pretty helpful to me

That would be very kind of you .