ghosts

[三江源]

Mak, how about the domestic incident involving my grandmother. Is that not grotesque and dirty enough to have been a real ghost?

[Apech]

By saying all beings are energy is too broad. That doesn't really explain what "ghosts" are though.

 

 

I was replying to the idea that there was no being(s) at all but just energy - by saying that the beings that are - are that energy. That's all.

 

A.

[TheWhiteRabbit]

You were right energy contains information also, or can, so you were right. Wait and see what happens......

Edited March 10, 2009 by TheWhiteRabbit

[Mak_Tin_Si]

Yes, that is a true one. There are many people who have this kind of exp. too.

 

Your grandmother is a ghost for sure of course, but you cannot say she is "dirty", just yin-spirit, so she is now no good to stick around with you for a long time. It makes you less healthy and reduce your luck too.

 

You can do some kind of afterdeath ceremony for her since you have some "yuen fun" (fate) with her because you seen her around. If you have that chance in life, do it for her to let her move on with peace.

 

 

Mak, how about the domestic incident involving my grandmother. Is that not grotesque and dirty enough to have been a real ghost?

 

 

Opening the yin-eye is of course getting yourself in a pool of "poo poo".

 

Think about this. You want to open the yin-eye, it is then not only about just the eye. You have to train and tuen yourself to be on the yin side (you are now on the yang side as normal human). Since you want to be on the yin-side, your energy, your luck and your health all decrease to achieve that state. If you open the yin-eye, you turn yourself into a yin-being also.

 

You can see your ancestors in hell suffering, that is a fact, not a believe, but only if you believe this experience is true from some elder taoist masters. If you do not believe other's exp, there is no point to discuss about this of course.

 

There are always some sacrifise if you want something. That is for sure fact.

[宁]

this sounds more like popular superstition and elementary folk witchkraft

 

what does this have to do with the spiritual science that is daoism

 

no clue whatsoever

 

superstition is popular

 

focusing the third eye is secret knowledge, all people have it open, but it's tricky to get it focused.

yes, so what?

 

how can this answer the Real problems in people's lives? most of them chase after the occult, but what they need are a warm hug, a cup of tea, and a good-good friend... or simmilar things.

 

you, mr. mak, instead of pointing that out, lure them more into the deep dungeons of the subconscious.

for profit.

 

that's a no-no. if you have any belief in karma, you should know what awaits you

[Mak_Tin_Si]

opening the third eye is not a superstitious talk. It is a kind of training that all taoism sect do have. Even if you go to WuDang for leanring, the master also have this kind of trianing too. Of course you need some connections to know these good masters who do not just teach you "wudang taichi" for fun.

 

If you want to know more about Taoism, I suggest you can really get to know the system more before judging. Taoism is not only philosophy.

[HouTian]

Lets say you are now open to a chance to learn this "Yin-Eye" in Taoism, which will open up your 3rd eye with the Yin-path, you can only see yin stuff, so you can see ghosts, and your ancestors suffer in hell and also see things happening in hell, will you take the chance to open it? (it's free and it's like you can click a button and get it online, easy easy)

 

 

This Myth has been around for Years. Not many people have Yin Eyes,But thousands proclaim too have this Skill. I have heard stories of people being able to see purple lights coming out of there ass,seeing energy,mist, ghost. Mostly its all lies & fantasy driven delusions combined with a good dose of wishful thinking.

 

Seeing ghost & aura is a high level skill that nobody here has even come close to achieving and probably never will.

 

The same old story always arises..............can you handle it,you will see ghost forever & not be able to close your eye blah blah blah. What a joke to even speak on such matters

[Mak_Tin_Si]

have you "tried" to cultivate this method before that can proof it is not true?

 

It is a myth to you becaues you do not know about it.

It's not a myth to me anymore because I knew about it.

[froggie]

This Myth has been around for Years. Not many people have Yin Eyes,But thousands proclaim too have this Skill. I have heard stories of people being able to see purple lights coming out of there ass,seeing energy,mist, ghost. Mostly its all lies & fantasy driven delusions combined with a good dose of wishful thinking.

 

Seeing ghost & aura is a high level skill that nobody here has even come close to achieving and probably never will.

 

The same old story always arises..............can you handle it,you will see ghost forever & not be able to close your eye blah blah blah. What a joke to even speak on such matters

 

Actually, how would you Really know?

 

From the way you talk it's probably not too difficult to say that you are just as delusional or even more than what you are speaking about. Also i don't think generalisatons work, and also, it wouldn't hurt to brush up your attitude a bit. But like i said before, sometimes it's too easy to talk mostly nonsense. can't really blame you though, but it could be a shame. probably is.

Edited March 10, 2009 by froggie

[Mak_Tin_Si]

In my lineage, we do you promote people to train in the yin eye. But we do taught people for the yang eye and they do see more than normal human beings as their trainings goes higher.

 

They can see at least sometimes "deities" around the altar area, or energy flow in fungshui. Very basic.

[HouTian]

I lived all over asia for more then 17 Years & believe me friend,I know. What people claim to have & what they can really do however is a totally different story. Yours is no different.

 

Sounds like you were tricked by some of these teachers & fooled into believing that you now know.

 

"Believe Those Who Seek The Truth But Doubt Those Who Find It."

 

I think that sums it up pretty well.

 

[Mak_Tin_Si]

Are you just 17 years old now then?

[HouTian]

Are you just 17 years old now then?

 

Never Argue With A Fool Because Those Watching May Not Tell The Difference.

 

Case Closed.

[Mak_Tin_Si]

wow. nice case file you have created here by coming in without contribution to the discussion. TTB really have alot of amazing scenaries...

[froggie]

I lived all over asia for more then 17 Years & believe me friend,I know. What people claim to have & what they can really do however is a totally different story. Yours is no different.

 

Sounds like you were tricked by some of these teachers & fooled into believing that you now know.

 

"Believe Those Who Seek The Truth But Doubt Those Who Find It."

 

I think that sums it up pretty well.

 

 

That still doesn't make complete sense to me... Apples and oranges. I can only detect a lacking in nuances, grades and other things. Ofcourse, in a way you may be right ... like it would be the case if someone insists in something when there may be more and greater nuances. But in that case that side doesn't fit and this side doesn't fit either. Apologies if this sounds abstract.

Edited March 11, 2009 by froggie

[Mak_Tin_Si]

is he 17 years old now?

 

(good question to consider)

[三江源]

Yes, Mak, you are right. In fact the truth is that I have seen my ancestors suffering in hell, as you put it. It didnt occur to me to frame it in that thought, and I didnt see it as 'poo poo' either. It was a poignant and painful part of life to be aware of, and I did various rituals etc to help them.

 

I would not consider this as something that I would choose to avoid. I would consider it as a service that it is a privelege to be able to offer.

[Mak_Tin_Si]

Cat, that's very good of you. You do have alot of respect for your ancestors which is a kind of "duck" (virtue) in taoism that lead to wealth and fortune too!

 

Great karma generated by you!

[goldisheavy]

Mak Tin Si,

 

Can you please explain the fascination with ghosts?

 

Personally I believe that we can create many flavors of apparent reality. There are some apparent realities where ghosts are a regular feature, and some where people don't even know what a ghost is, and never mind ghosts making an appearance. From my point of view, seeing ghost is not more or less true, and it is not more or less spiritual, than not seeing ghosts. It's just a choice that from the point of view of a wisdom seeker is neither here nor there. Ghosts are basically ornamental, as I see it, like any other appearance.

 

But as ornaments, ghosts are ugly, useless and tasteless, and they introduce too much instability into the perceived world. This is why I don't allow ghosts to appear in my perceived reality.

 

At the same time, I don't have anything against ghosts at the ultimate level. I don't think ghosts are bad or evil or "to be avoided at all costs" or anything like that. So I am curious about your fascination with ghosts. Maybe I am wrong, but seems you have quite some fascination and passion for ghosts.

 

So are ghosts fun? Do you like to play with ghosts? What's good about ghosts? If you had to sing the virtues of ghosts, what would you say? If a person who can see ghosts is superior, then how exactly is a person who can see ghosts superior to a person who cannot see them, in your view?

 

If I do give birth to ethereal beings, they are going to be non-traditional meditative deities of my own making. I don't think I will be giving birth to ghosts soon.

Edited March 12, 2009 by goldisheavy

[Yoda]

I think not becoming one is the point.

[TheWhiteRabbit]

Acts 2:38

 

Lake of fire is where the enemies go.

 

Edited June 27, 2023 by TheWhiteRabbit

[goldisheavy]

I think not becoming one is the point.

 

What's wrong with being a ghost? I think what I would want is expressiveness at the soul level. If my soul feels like manifesting myself as a ghost, that's wonderful. Trouble would arise only if I somehow became stuck in that state. As long as I am free and uninhibited in my transformation, no particular transformation is bad.

 

I don't mean this in a condescending way at all, but just to make my point perfectly clear, I want to give this example.

 

Imagine that you're in a forest and there are holes in the ground. Now, a person might say "Be careful of the holes! Avoid the holes!" Why? Because if you fall in, you are not likely to get out and your day is ruined. Plus people generally do not enjoy holes. However, what if you can come and go as you please? What if there is no way you can get stuck in a hole? And what if some holes have interesting bugs in them and some have gems deep down, and so on, then perhaps falling into a hole can be very good? So the hole is not inherently bad, it's being stuck in it that's bad, and this perception is intensified if you think negatively of the holes to begin with. So if you think holes have nothing interesting in them, that would intensify the badness of being stuck in one.

 

I don't think there is anything inherently bad or wrong with being a ghost. But according to my taste, it's just ugly. But I don't think it's something to be avoided at all costs either. It's kind of like anchovies.

 

But really when you die, how you live your life now is pretty much how it will be in the other world.

So if you make this life out to be a hell, then yes you will be in hell.

(snip)

But even thoughtforms, egregores, godforms can all created and fall under the category of ghost, yes.

 

I agree completely. BTW, I think "egregore" is a very cool concept. I think it's more interesting than a ghost at least.

Edited March 12, 2009 by goldisheavy

[Mak_Tin_Si]

The idea of "ghost" you have here is people or animal who died.. which we call a ghost spirit. Gwai Wun. You cannot give birth to ghost, when their are "born" they are human or living beings already.

 

Ghost is composed of 2 wun (hun) and human have 3.

[goldisheavy]

The idea of "ghost" you have here is people or animal who died.. which we call a ghost spirit. Gwai Wun. You cannot give birth to ghost, when their are "born" they are human or living beings already.

 

Ghost is composed of 2 wun (hun) and human have 3.

 

Ok, if I understand correctly, from your point of view, ghosts simply exist whether we like it or not, so if we don't see ghosts, we're missing out on seeing a part of reality. And if we see ghosts, then we have a more complete picture of reality.

 

So I guess you don't accept that realities can differ? That there are different perceptual paradigms?

 

So you don't see yourself a cosmic womb that gives birth to this universe every moment?

Edited March 12, 2009 by goldisheavy

[Mak_Tin_Si]

When one person die, their 3 souls (hun) departs and assemble again, so you do not have a body but another form living with only the souls (hun). When you have 2 hun stick together, that is what we called "gwai wun" which is ghost-souls. The reason for using the word "ghost" is because it is yin, hidden, unseen.

 

You can also say one have a ghost heart - saying that the person think evil at the back all the time

 

or a ghost eye - saying that you see and look at evil stuff at people's back all the time

 

Ghost do not only mean dead people in chinese and taoism.