Kunlun follow up poll

[Mal]

but I am totally sure that there is an objective reality.

 

I'm not as sure as I was, currently leaning more towards a subjective reality which can be slightly (greatly) different for everyone.......

 

i.e. basically this quote "You are not what you think you are. But what you think... you are."

[Guest winpro07]

Objective, subjective/subjective, objective-subjective,objective/objective,subjective on and on and on

[Trunk]

you questioned prior if i manifest I already wrote about it, several pages back

 

I have been using a description of beliefs and their effects as a model to show what lay beyond all belief.

 

intent

Undoubtedly there are some real gems in this line of inquiry (and I mean that genuinely), but it's rather highjacking this thread. I suggest that you start a new thread and sort it out there.

[Guest winpro07]

where ever is your intent, there is also your experience.

There is no law governing intent

 

Beliefs are an effect of duality and fade behind intent.

 

There are very few constants in experience. It all come and goes from

moment to moment even that pesky cold. You really have to intend to

be involved or it will not exist.

 

This thread is a reply to kunlun poll. Its running deep because of the nature of the reason for creating it. I expect everyone will simply make one comment and one vote then go?

Undoubtedly there are some real gems in this line of inquiry (and I mean that genuinely), but it's rather highjacking this thread. I suggest that you start a new thread and sort it out there.

Edited April 12, 2009 by winpro07

[Trunk]

It was a suggestion. Of course everyone has their choice, especially on a www forum.

There's always the "ignore" list, and no limit on the number of posts/thread I suppose.

 

 

~ later edit ~

Maybe I'm being harsh; I'm in a cranky mood today.

 

But at the same time, Yoda - for all the years that I've seen him on this board - has been perhaps the most good-natured, humorous, love-for-all, unlikely to speak harshly of any teacher or student or passer-by. And that he feels that he needs to come out and say some things like he is trying to say... I think he deserves that the thread stays mostly on-topic.

 

Also, Winpro, I know that you are being sincere and that you've experienced and promoted some really extraordinary progress.

Edited April 13, 2009 by Trunk

[mgd]

...

Edited April 13, 2009 by mgd

[mgd]

...

Edited April 13, 2009 by mgd

[sahaj]

Actually I would expect there to be more book people than forum people, but that's a guess because UNLIKE the kunlun forum TTB is open to all

 

Keeping that forum closed is such a bizarre / suspicious decision.

 

Especially since people having access to SOMEONE to ask questions / get help from seems to be such a common desire. I would have kept doing Kunlun with more interaction. Regardless of if it's "needed" or not, it seems to be the most common problem, lack of support.

 

But I'm against closed forums personally so a bit of my bias there

I would expect most to stop the practice. Didn't even Chris write that he stopped for 6 years and came back. Max wrote almost nobody can do level 2 (or has the desire to see it through)

 

Yes I agree..WHY is the forum closed? And why put a book out there that you can learn an incredibly powerful technique from and give absolutely no backup support. I'm just talking about basic questions about the process not leaning on the teacher or making him/her responsible for what comes out of us when the bliss stirs our muddy glass of water. I've asked the admin of the Kunlun forum to be let into the forum as a sincere practitioner of what is presented in the book. Never heard back...so the experiences here on this site are the only feedback I can get outside my own wisdom experience. I can't help feeling it is a little irresponsible to present this stuff in book form, but if this practice wasn't in book form I wouldn't have been able to find it!

So its a double edged sword, sharp on both sides. As far as demons and dark entities go, my belief is that they are only alive by fear, and most likely they are usually just our darkness that we don't want to face up to.

Edited April 13, 2009 by sahaj

[growant]

for those wanting access to the kunlun forum, you're not missing much. When I used to go there regularly, Max's posts were few and far between and mostly it was a lot of low-level students giving (questionable, though well intended, I guess) advice to other low-level students.

[susie]

Yoda,

I do not think you have failed. I have more thoughts on this and would like to talk to you more about it...

 

Gloria, I never said anything was all fun and games. I understand that with every high experience there is a low. As we continue on the path, the polarities of thought merge closer, and we become more peaceful.

 

I would like to say, that when i was afraid and had questions, Max was present to answer them and he did help me. He did give me a sensation of Bliss in a workshop, it did not feel "wrong" in any way.

I have only experienced Max as playful and compassionate and helpful to me and others.

I feel the need to express this because I was skeptical of this practice at first. And now I understand and see much more clearly...

 

It is a root that works for me.

I am very sensitive to it, so I take it slow.

I have had experiences of much purification, my sky eye opening and my mind learning more about itself.

The fear happens when there is something i do not understand, but once understood with experience it naturally disappears.

The more i focus on fear, the more ill side effects i experience~ in this practice and life in general.

It is that simple, but not that easy.

 

Kunlun works for me, so I still practice it. If it did not i would stop. Simple.

 

I feel a bit intimidated to post here mostly because of all the hostility i sense.

However I find it a rich resource of information and exchange of ideas...

wish there was more of that on the kunlun sight.

 

Love and appreciation to all of you,

susie

[mgd]

...

Edited April 13, 2009 by mgd

[Taomeow]

for those wanting access to the kunlun forum, you're not missing much. When I used to go there regularly, Max's posts were few and far between and mostly it was a lot of low-level students giving (questionable, though well intended, I guess) advice to other low-level students.

Personally, I don't go to forums for advice -- not anywhere or anywhen except when I'm in the company of people who have studied professionally or otherwise in great depth something I didn't -- e.g., I'd go for advice to groups like Physics New Ideas (mostly peopled by professional physicists) and so on.

 

There's no taoist forum currently in existence that is comprised of professional taoists. Kunlun forum is no exception. I tried to run a theoretical idea of mine there regarding the energy of kunlun, and discovered at a very early stage that I simply don't have a common frame of reference with anyone, so I just dropped it and limited my (very sporadic) activities to the personal practice section. Which is useful if you want to keep track of your own and others' practice dynamics. E.g., I learned -- without asking for advice specifically, without even knowing that it's something I need to ask about --

 

that whatever happens in the beginning is no indicator of how it might go a bunch of months down the road. Take Yoda. I seem to remember that he used to describe his kunlun experience as mild, nothing too intense going on... then wham -- something IS going on, and -- well, you know the rest of the story. So I'm thinking, Yoda's kunlun experience started earlier than mine, mine was never "mild" from the start, so -- what kind of advice should I be asking for?.. Who's equipped to give it?..

 

Nobody. Not even Max...

[Guest winpro07]

This practice brings fist and foremost self reliance. Answers provided from outside your self only hinder your progress

 

Yes I agree..WHY is the forum closed? And why put a book out there that you can learn an incredibly powerful technique from and give absolutely no backup support.

Edited April 13, 2009 by winpro07

[Yoda]

So I just reread everything... the basic themes as I see it:

 

~~~

 

Kunlun is good. No problems aside from the fact that waking up has its challenges like with any path.

 

Kunlun is good but like attracts like so if you get stuck in fear you'll have some bad experiences.

 

Kunlun is good but you have to get past the lower astral ghosts etc through prayer, intention, and lineage. If you can't, then find another teacher.

 

Kunlun has virus problems.

 

~~~

 

 

Did I miss any?

[rain]

regularly? *coughs*

I miss the question "do you still do kunlun irregularly, now and then?"

[sahaj]

This practice brings fist and foremost self reliance. Answers provided from outside your self only hinder your progress

 

yes you are right

[三江源]

.

Edited July 21, 2014 by cat

[freeform]

[Yoda]

Freeform,

 

Thanks for sharing... I was hoping for your take on all this.

 

I can see how a tradition that has intimate, long term, one on one mentoring relationships could negotiate possible trickster vibes.

 

Given that the airspace may possibly contain competing frequencies, is spontaneous practice ok for the average modern world person without a teacher?

 

Also, do you think that all spontaneous practices are equal?

 

My thinking is that different teachers may have tapped into different frequencies and therefore they are not equal.

 

I apologize for being so unrelentingly negative. I'll try to chill out and shut up soon.

 

Your pal,

Yoda

[Taomeow]

(quote -- Freeform) My opinion on Kunlun is that firstly it opens you up to see what is there already. The transmission makes you into a kind of lightning rod, attracting to you whatever is needed for you to ascend... that includes all the good and bad stuff that needs to be processed and whatever help and assistance that you must receive

 

So is mine. Very consistent with my own experience.

[Taomeow]

By the way, my young cat occasionally does kunlun in his sleep. The left hind leg mostly. According to Max, it means his yin energy needs balancing.

[Cameron]

..

Edited April 17, 2009 by Cameron

[joeblast]

(quote -- Freeform) My opinion on Kunlun is that firstly it opens you up to see what is there already. The transmission makes you into a kind of lightning rod, attracting to you whatever is needed for you to ascend... that includes all the good and bad stuff that needs to be processed and whatever help and assistance that you must receive

 

So is mine. Very consistent with my own experience.

ditto

[susie]

ditto

yes indeed...

[Aetherous]

My opinion on Kunlun is that firstly it opens you up to see what is there already.

 

Not in my experience. The negative health I experienced with Kunlun was never there in the first place. And I had previously penetrated the absolute depths of who I am, and was in great health. So this is something added to me from doing the practices...something external and uninvited.

 

It could be said that it's a manifestation of deep unconscious karma, or something, and I can see how that makes sense...but I don't personally agree with that theory. It doesn't feel like the right answer to me at all. I never had this much karma.

 

Speaking of that, the energy has hindered my meditation. I have been wondering why it's done that for a while now, while trying to remain positive about my experiences with the practice...and now I don't care: it hasn't helped me progress.

 

I don't view the practice as spiritual anymore. It has nothing to do with actual letting go, and has everything to do with getting stuck. All the talk of letting go by practitioners is just rhetoric. I know because I've actually let go once...it's much deeper than we think, and isn't a choice we can make.

 

The bliss state is something external from our true nature. The "transformation" which comes about as a result, that some have apparently attained, isn't real enlightenment. There are ways to test the quality of someone's attainment, and kunluners always fail the tests. Mostly due to self centered emotional issues.

 

Just my opinion. Everyone is free to do what they want, and believe what they want. I am happy to have shared the experience with many of you, who are great people and who I consider friends. I still like Max...but I'm done with Kunlun now, completely. Moving on...it feels good.