Right then...

[Wells]

Well....I hate to tell you the TRUTH but,

You will NEVER find it the way you are looking for it.

Dude, the right to exist of guys like you (Gurus with a weak but inflated Ego,

no real archievements but the talent to sell themselves to naive ones) is that

real searchers like me in their younger years (like maybe More_Pie_Guy)

can learn the hard way through getting screwed so they lose their naivety.

The guys that stick to you are easy to satisfy and like the little things you offer

and like getting told that they are the big deal and so you are the right one for them,

because they don't deserve more.

And no, you are not telling the truth.

And I tell you a second time, don't bother about me, I am on the right way

for myself, I am convinced of it.

...or are that last trys to "convert" me by trying to make me insecure?

you are very funny!

All right, I scrapped you concerning myself and so I'm done with you...

 

Peace

[Mokona]

Dude, the right to exist of guys like you (Gurus with a weak but inflated Ego,

no real archievements but the talent to sell themselves to naive ones) is that

real searchers like me in their younger years (like maybe More_Pie_Guy)

can learn the hard way through getting screwed so they lose their naivety.

The guys that stick to you are easy to satisfy and like the little things you offer

and like getting told that they are the big deal and so you are the right one for them,

because they don't deserve more.

And no, you are not telling the truth.

And I tell you a second time, don't bother about me, I am on the right way

for myself, I am convinced of it.

...or are that last trys to "convert" me by trying to make me insecure?

you are very funny!

All right, I scrapped you concerning myself and so I'm done with you...

 

Peace

 

 

I've noticed the lack of respect being shown, and I wonder how you can make statements like that about anyone? Have you ever met in person? What is it, that is so wonderful about you that you can just tell people what they are? Aren't you getting into that yourself? "You can't tell me what path to choose becuase I already know what is best for me." Then you state something that sounds decidely the same.

This sort of place was not created as a test of wit, or a place where insults should be thrown. If you don't like a practice, or a technique, or even a teacher you simply don't need to associate with that person. That set of techniques don't need to be practiced by you. Honestly, I think the some of these posts show your type of character, DB/Pie/GIH.

Why would you expect anyone not to be insulted or stand up for themselves after being shown such disrespect? I'm not a fighter, but if you were to speak to me that way in person we would brawl. The point isn't even who would win such a contest.

I guess I'm disapointed to find such trollish behavior, no matter how intelligent and witty you decide to make the post. It still is what it is.

Do ya'll have anything to give? Anything at all? Have you not seen any good being done for the people who have been to these classes or his advice? Or do you choose to ignore it?

 

You could say I'm even getting too involved in this conversation. I'm just sick of the bashing that goes on in forums. I doubt any of ya'll would speak this way in person. In fact I guarentee it.

[Wells]

I've noticed the lack of respect being shown, and I wonder how you can make statements like that about anyone? Have you ever met in person? What is it, that is so wonderful about you that you can just tell people what they are? Aren't you getting into that yourself? "You can't tell me what path to choose becuase I already know what is best for me." Then you state something that sounds decidely the same.

This sort of place was not created as a test of wit, or a place where insults should be thrown. If you don't like a practice, or a technique, or even a teacher you simply don't need to associate with that person. That set of techniques don't need to be practiced by you. Honestly, I think the some of these posts show your type of character, DB/Pie/GIH.

Why would you expect anyone not to be insulted or stand up for themselves after being shown such disrespect? I'm not a fighter, but if you were to speak to me that way in person we would brawl. The point isn't even who would win such a contest.

I guess I'm disapointed to find such trollish behavior, no matter how intelligent and witty you decide to make the post. It still is what it is.

Do ya'll have anything to give? Anything at all? Have you not seen any good being done for the people who have been to these classes or his advice? Or do you choose to ignore it?

 

You could say I'm even getting too involved in this conversation. I'm just sick of the bashing that goes on in forums. I doubt any of ya'll would speak this way in person. In fact I guarentee it.

Dude, I was just "working this guy through" to realize quickly if he has to give something to s.o. like me who really wants to archieve something and is not satisfied with archieving "to feel good" or something. I observe the market what good systems are available....as they all (all GOOD methods concerning immortality) include similar methods whether they are jewish, chinese or indian. And someone who has a good method to offer has to be powerful as all good methods amass large amounts of chi in you (that's the raw material to work with) and also increase your ability to control chi (how else should you be able to work successful with Chi?). Many people don't get that! THAT's real power, you become more and more powerful...and that changes your character and makes it more and more stable; what shows up especially if s.o. is attacking you. I mean why becoming emotionally aggressive, defencive, ignorant or hurt if a butterfly attacks you...? So that's why I behave like that when testing a personality who claims to be great...to expose him quickly and to realize if he is powerful or not. Over the Internet, because I am unable to test his abilities in person, it's the best choice to test his character to get a clear picture fast. I got that now, no more attacking necessary.

"How can you claim to know somebody if you have not fought him yet?"

[Aetherous]

Interesting: I used to think that being able to control qi would make someone serene, as well. However, that seems to not be the case after seeing all of the advanced guys at this forum and how they behave. Now I see that qigong has little effect on a person's character, besides maybe amplifying it.

 

Except for maybe spontaneous qigong practices, which do seem to make a person less likely to banter...

 

I don't know why Vajrasattva defends himself so much (he doesn't need to), but the fact is that he does "have the juice". I once ordered a book from him and he sent some sort of attunement, which made things pretty fun for the day. At one point I was getting hit on by this mom in the mall, while it seemed like streams of energy were flowing through and around me. A little disorienting.

 

I agree with Mokona, that your behavior is trollish, Dorian. I don't know why we're getting so many of your type lately. My advice is just to take it easy, use the search tool, and genuinely be interested in learning from anyone who has something to offer you. At some forums there is an unsaid code of conduct, where a newbie is not really allowed to give their opinion...I kind of like it that way, because the newbie can learn how things work and see who people are without having to "test them" first. Conversations go better that way. So, just shut up for a while and it'll be good for you.

[Vajrasattva]

Interesting: I used to think that being able to control qi would make someone serene, as well. However, that seems to not be the case after seeing all of the advanced guys at this forum and how they behave. Now I see that qigong has little effect on a person's character, besides maybe amplifying it.

 

Except for maybe spontaneous qigong practices, which do seem to make a person less likely to banter...

 

I don't know why Vajrasattva defends himself so much (he doesn't need to), but the fact is that he does "have the juice". I once ordered a book from him and he sent some sort of attunement, which made things pretty fun for the day. At one point I was getting hit on by this mom in the mall, while it seemed like streams of energy were flowing through and around me. A little disorienting.

 

I agree with Mokona, that your behavior is trollish, Dorian. I don't know why we're getting so many of your type lately. My advice is just to take it easy, use the search tool, and genuinely be interested in learning from anyone who has something to offer you. At some forums there is an unsaid code of conduct, where a newbie is not really allowed to give their opinion...I kind of like it that way, because the newbie can learn how things work and see who people are without having to "test them" first. Conversations go better that way. So, just shut up for a while and it'll be good for you.

 

I will not deny that I am also Human : )

 

Scotty its good to hear from you. I am gladd Mama treated you will for the day and that you hopefully got something out of it : )

 

I was just trying to educate Dorian & More Pie. I do for the record DB & MPG wish you both the best if you remeber correctly you guys asked for me not the other way around....

 

Please by all means succeed in your research and your quest to be JOHN CHANG....

 

But will tell you this much and you will remember my words one day when you actually go through a real self realization.....none of it is possible with out the grace of the Creator.

 

Science Does NOT have the answers you are looking for. It did not have the answers when it tested John Chang or when Pak Muhammad cures people of cancer with his buffalo horns and finger nails....

 

 

 

Peace & God Bless

 

Santiago

[Mokona]

Dude, I was just "working this guy through" to realize quickly if he has to give something to s.o. like me who really wants to archieve something and is not satisfied with archieving "to feel good" or something. I observe the market what good systems are available...

"How can you claim to know somebody if you have not fought him yet?"

 

So you attack someone until they show you what you want? you don't see anything wrong with that? Do you walk into a dojo and throw punches at the instructor to see how he reacts?

[Zensunni Wanderer]

I have no vested interest in this argument, but when we say that there are fakirs who can magically cure cancer with keratin.....Yeah, I'm a have to call bullshit in absence of rigorous evidence. When people say that god gives them magic powers, I start looking for the kool aid pitcher.

[Vajrasattva]

I have no vested interest in this argument, but when we say that there are fakirs who can magically cure cancer with keratin.....Yeah, I'm a have to call bullshit in absence of rigorous evidence. When people say that god gives them magic powers, I start looking for the kool aid pitcher.

 

 

Haha When is the last time you touched hands with Pak Muhammad? Also when is the last time you came to train with me?

 

Why is everyone afraid to give Credit to God???

 

 

I know it certainly wasn't "US" that created anything.

 

Let alone "Chi".

 

More like the other way around.

[Squatting Monkey]

Then who created the creator ?

[Vajrasattva]

Then who created the creator ?

 

 

Its true Self : )

 

it doesn't matter what you call it but its from that that ALL POWER/ ENERGY/ABILITY EXISTENCE comes from.

[Zensunni Wanderer]

Edited April 20, 2009 by Zensunni Wanderer

[Vajrasattva]

[Zensunni Wanderer]

No, it's not my job to go to the Himalayas or Amazon to ascertain every wild ass claim a charlatan makes. It's your job to prove a wild claim. QED.

[Vajrasattva]

No, it's not my job to go to the Himalayas or Amazon to ascertain every wild ass claim a charlatan makes. It's your job to prove a wild claim. QED.

 

 

I do not have to prove anything. I know what Pak can do. I have felt it, seen it, and done it.

 

What is so WILD about Internal ENERGY Healing???

 

You are the one on TAO BUMBS a place where many here do it and have had experience healing many types of ailments etc.

[Zensunni Wanderer]

You make very strong assertions and than say you have nothing to prove. In my considerable experience, only hucksters do that. I'm aware that holistic medicine can do certain things; it can also do them under controlled conditions. Your claim that magic men can mystically channel cancer off someone but you'll never bother to prove it, just cos 'God' likes them so much? Different story entirely. If you were a snake-handling Protestant from the Ozarks, nobody would take it seriously, but because it's "Eastern Wisdom" or some such bollocks, you seem to mostly get a pass here. I'm not interested in what snake oil you're selling, just in pointing out that it appears to be snake oil. Peace.

[Vajrasattva]

You make very strong assertions and than say you have nothing to prove. In my considerable experience, only hucksters do that. I'm aware that holistic medicine can do certain things; it can also do them under controlled conditions. Your claim that magic men can mystically channel cancer off someone but you'll never bother to prove it, just cos 'God' likes them so much? Different story entirely. If you were a snake-handling Protestant from the Ozarks, nobody would take it seriously, but because it's "Eastern Wisdom" or some such bollocks, you seem to mostly get a pass here. I'm not interested in what snake oil you're selling, just in pointing out that it appears to be snake oil. Peace.

 

 

haha yes i sell Snake Oil. Also if you want I sell Cimande Oil as well but that comes after the bruises : )

[VCraigP]

The Tao Bums announces the Bummies.

 

TTB awards for online participation.

 

For the highest achievement in the category of compassionate troll feeding.

 

And the winner is;

 

Vajrasattva.

 

Love

 

Craig

[Zensunni Wanderer]

I have, through the grace of Isis, discovered the ability to cure AIDS with snail shells. I refuse to demonstrate this and as Isis is kinda fickle, it may not always work. I may be able to train you to do it too, basically come to the Himalayas and I'll teach you AIDS-curing shell Yoga at a reasonable rate. What does Isis have to do with the Himalayas? Moving on. Now, you may think it's uncompassionate to claim the power to end so much human suffering and death after a few yoga classes, and refuse to subject this claim to inquiry, but that's just how I roll. I'm super-compassionate, really. Question that and you must just be a troll.

[forestofsouls]

Zensunni,

 

Everything is in a context. Santiago (Vajrasattva) may not be the most eloquent poster, but the reason people defend him is because of what he has done and taught for people on this very forum. Personal experience trumps all.

 

Seriously--- you think that a forum like this hasn't had its share of hacks?

 

You've been here a few days and all I've seen are negative posts and criticisms. Do you have anything positive to contribute?

[Zensunni Wanderer]

"Everything is in a context. Santiago (Vajrasattva) may not be the most eloquent poster, but the reason people defend him is because of what he has done and taught for people on this very forum. Personal experience trumps all."

 

I'm sorry, if you claim you can sure cancer, the ability to make people feel warm and fuzzy over the internet doesn't cut it.

 

"Seriously--- you think that a forum like this hasn't had its share of hacks?"

 

Man, I'm not even taking that one--it's just too easy.

 

"You've been here a few days and all I've seen are negative posts and criticisms. Do you have anything positive to contribute?"

 

Yeah, the guy who started this thread seems like a real ray of fuckin' sunshine. That being said, if you think I'm wrong on something, address my actual arguments. Most of my posts haven't been negative, just skeptical--I was resolved to stay away from this argument til I saw the ridiculous "curing cancer" claim. It's really shameful that people are equivocating on that point. I'm not a vindictive or even "negative" person, I'm just not going to fawn over people and kiss their asses and agree that 2+2=5.

[Aetherous]

Zensunni,

 

I think you bring up good points. The only thing I'll say is don't judge every book by its cover. Sometimes a great cover will turn out to contain a horrible story. Sometimes a horrible cover will turn out to have a great story within. It's good to keep an open mind, because although we've seen a lot, we haven't seen everything. There is always some mystery to this life. Part of being wise is knowing this, and keeping your mouth shut until you've "read through the whole book" or completed the training.

 

And if something's not for you, then it's not for you.

 

PS...I also agree that unless you can consistently cure people of cancer, you shouldn't be claiming it's possible. Because then people with cancer might see it, come to you, and be let down. But then, even results like curing cancer 50% of the time would be good...

[forestofsouls]

Zensunni,

 

Santiago didn't say he cured cancer. He said Pak Muhammad did.

 

The trouble is that you see what you want to see. Warm and fuzzy? You see what you want to see.

 

Reality is funny like that. Which is why it's pointless to argue--- especially when some one has made up their mind already.

 

 

 

I'm sorry, if you claim you can sure cancer, the ability to make people feel warm and fuzzy over the internet doesn't cut it.

 

.......

 

Yeah, the guy who started this thread seems like a real ray of fuckin' sunshine. That being said, if you think I'm wrong on something, address my actual arguments. Most of my posts haven't been negative, just skeptical--I was resolved to stay away from this argument til I saw the ridiculous "curing cancer" claim. It's really shameful that people are equivocating on that point. I'm not a vindictive or even "negative" person, I'm just not going to fawn over people and kiss their asses and agree that 2+2=5.

[Zensunni Wanderer]

That's such a non-rebuttal I don't even know how to respond. Fine, he said his TEACHER can magically cure cancer, not that he can. The substance of everything I said still stands. And what, you're an impartial observer? Not buyin it, buddy.

 

And Scotty, if he could cure it 50% of the time, that would still be an amazing claim that would require proof. Sometimes you need the whole story to know what someone's about, but sometimes they make it very clear from the outset.

[Owledge]

While cancer is not at all funny, when you're not constricted by disinformation, it's really a joke. Let the people of the world put all knowledge together to cure it and let them freely do their work and it could be cured worldwide in no-time. It would lose all its horror and be seen like a cold that you cure with chicken-soup.

And the same goes for AIDS.

 

Thus, personally I react increasingly puzzled when people make such a drama about claims of being able to cure cancer with unconventional methods. Especially considering that the conventional methods include cutting flesh out and poisoning the body, hoping that the immune system lasts longer than the tumor.

 

But oh well... the medical establishment begins to accept psychological factors as relevant for cancer cure, so I guess it's just a matter of time before they consider this normal and obvious, like it has never been different.

[goldisheavy]

That's such a non-rebuttal I don't even know how to respond. Fine, he said his TEACHER can magically cure cancer, not that he can. The substance of everything I said still stands. And what, you're an impartial observer? Not buyin it, buddy.

 

And Scotty, if he could cure it 50% of the time, that would still be an amazing claim that would require proof. Sometimes you need the whole story to know what someone's about, but sometimes they make it very clear from the outset.

 

What's happening is that you're encountering claims of phenomena that don't fit into your validation framework. That's perfectly normal, although most people are unconscious of their validation frameworks and I guarantee you, that based on how you talk about phenomenological issues, you are unconscious of yours too. Guaran-fucking-tee you.

 

Regardless of whether or not Vajrasattva's claims are true, you should at least examine your own bias and your own core beliefs. Instead of challenging everyone around you to prove their core beliefs to you, your task on this forum is to challenge your own core belief by yourself and rely on other people for help, but not to do the legwork for you!