Who am I meditation

[alfa]

If one asks 'who am I,' what next? I am getting nowhere with this. People say one can experience the non-dual state. But after asking who am I, the same mental processes continue. So what difference does it make?

[de_paradise]

I've started doing this meditation, and yes it requires some kind of refining as you get to know it, as many types of meditations only include the very basic instructions but the keys are to be discovered.

 

In answer of your mental process question, you have to say to the thoughts that come up, "not self", just as you say "not self" to your body, the ambient sense data that is streaming in.

 

It doesnt leave you with much, but that rejection of the crude body, sense data, and thoughts is enough. There is nothing there, just a vague instuction to find who you are. You will not consciously detect it, but subconsciously there is a kind of search going on, and when you approach your goal by rejecting "neti, neti" not this, not this, a kind of powerful internal alchemical reaction will get switched on, at times, when you get closer to the self.

 

The conscious may try to fixate on something, be it a location in your body, say your head or near heart chakra. It can attempt to find a more refined energy within your body, say that "inner qi", or extra-body type aura layer---well, those are the kinds of things my mind seems to want to test out, looking for the self. The voidness or blankness of mind, plus the intention to find the self, is generally the most powerful place to park in terms of getting your qi and nadis etc. into turbo. (I'd just like to mention that I feel my qi and nadis in my head, as well as percieve the relative exitation states, which gives feedback to my trial and error tests. What I mean is that I didnt get this answer from a text nor pull it from my ass,)

[Aetherous]

Some things to consider:

 

If one asks 'who am I,' what next? I am getting nowhere with this.

 

Is the self that you found actually the one getting nowhere?

 

If you find a self, is it really you?

 

People say one can experience the non-dual state.

 

Who exactly experiences the non-dual state?

 

But after asking who am I, the same mental processes continue. So what difference does it make?

 

It's not just asking, but finding out for sure exactly who you are.

 

Are you sure that you're the one who was asking, after you find the answer? Is it really you that finds the answer?

 

The mental processes never stop until the brain dies...it doesn't make any difference.

[Birch]

This is not a trick question!

 

Why did you start doing it?

 

Did you have a goal in mind or did someone tell you to do it?

[xabir2005]

If one asks 'who am I,' what next? I am getting nowhere with this. People say one can experience the non-dual state. But after asking who am I, the same mental processes continue. So what difference does it make?

An e-mail reply to me by Thusness in 2006:

The AMness can be said to be a form of absorption where the object of concentration is the Self. It can be a question "Who am I" that leads one to the experience of the subject-object becoming one. Till a point the practitioner simply experiences a pure sense of existence. However such mode of experience has no understanding of its luminous clarity and its nature as anatta. The key point about mindful awareness is there is no keeping of the mind on anything and by not resting on anything, it fuses into everything; therefore it cannot be concentrated; rather it is to relax into nothingness empty of self, empty of any artifical doing so that the natural luminosity can take its own course. There is no focusing, there is only allowing the mirror bright clarity to shine with it natural radiance. In essence there is no one there, only the phenomenon arisng and ceasing telling their stories.

 

 

And an excerpt from "The Spiritual Teachings of Ramana Maharshi":

"D. But is it not funny that the 'I' should be searching for the 'I'? Does not the enquiry, 'Who am I?' turn out in the end an empty formula? Or, am I put the question to myself endlessly, repeating it like some mantra?

 

M. Self-enquiry is certainly not an empty formula; it is more than repetition of any mantra. If the enquiry, "Who am I?'' were a mere mental questioning, it would not be of much value. The very purpose of Self-enquiry is to focus the entire mind at its Source. It is not, therefore, a case of one 'I' searching for another 'I'.

 

Much less is Self-enquiry an empty formula, for it involves an intense activity of the entire mind to keep it steadily poised in pure Self-awareness.

 

Self-enquiry is the one, infallible means, the only direct one, to realize the unconditioned, absolute Being that you really are."

 

 

I also find the first article by Ken Wilber pretty helpful: http://awakeningtoreality.blogspot.com/200...ity-by-ken.html

Edited May 3, 2009 by xabir2005

[xabir2005]

Edited May 3, 2009 by xabir2005

[alfa]

Thanks everyone for your replies.

 

And Xabir, thanks for posting Ramana's self-inquiry method. I've read it before, and I find it a little confusing. When one tries to find out 'who am I' there is no "I" to be found! That's why I am wondering how one can abide in the "I am" awareness when there's no I apart from body, mind etc. What I mean is, when one asks 'who am I' there's simply a blankness, after which the mind continues its perpetual chatter.

[xabir2005]

Edited May 3, 2009 by xabir2005

[mat black]

Nice xabir2005, very nicely said.

[mYTHmAKER]

Who am i is similar to a zen koan in that there is no mind answer.

At some point the mind gets stopped - no mind - and the answer appears

but it is experiential and cannot be known by the everyday mind.

 

There was an older thread on this subject - might be worth a search

[sahaj]

The question "Who am I?" is a process not a goal. Its function is to turn the awareness back upon itself. I find it uncovers what isn't "I" more than finding some "I"

[mYTHmAKER]

The question "Who am I?" is a process not a goal. Its function is to turn the awareness back upon itself. I find it uncovers what isn't "I" more than finding some "I"

 

It might just turn out what isn't i is everything

[doc benway]

Interesting comments!

Alfa - this is NOT an easy process. It's a long and arduous method but can yield beautiful results. It's not one to try and 'understand.' It is meant to be lived, not thought about.

Good luck!

[mat black]

The last 4 posts are beautiful.

Who am i is similar to a zen koan

Indeed.

More on Ramana can be found here

http://www.thetaobums.com/Ramanaand39s-40-...lity-t5270.html

[goldisheavy]

If one asks 'who am I,' what next? I am getting nowhere with this. People say one can experience the non-dual state. But after asking who am I, the same mental processes continue. So what difference does it make?

 

First of all, there is no such thing as non-dual state. If there was, then this non-dual state, being distinct from the dual one, would still be dual, and therefore would be a deluded state. Instead, the word non-dual refers not to some experiential state, but rather to the nature of reality or to the nature of any and all experience, etc.

 

Second, the reason it's good to ask "Who am I" is because you may have a lot of beliefs about who you are. You probably think you know very well who you are. Because of that, you also think you know what you're capable of. And you think you know what you're incapable of. In the process of seriously and honestly investigating who you are, you may discover that your beliefs about yourself were nothing more than baseless superstitions. This discovery may change what you are capable of doing and what you are capable of not-doing and what you are capable of enjoying. So it's very important. It's obvious why it's important, right?

 

But if you're 100% happy and content right now, then don't waste your time. Just enjoy! Don't meditate.

[Unconditioned]

If one asks 'who am I,' what next? I am getting nowhere with this. People say one can experience the non-dual state. But after asking who am I, the same mental processes continue. So what difference does it make?

 

Who/what/how is watching those processes?

 

Another way to approach "who am I?" is to follow it up with deeper investigation - Am I my body? Am I my senses? Am I my memories? Am I my future projections? Am I the 'watcher' of my thoughts?

 

As others have said, you'll discover what you are not and a result of the inquiry will be truth, an experiential truth.

 

For example, lets say I think I'm an amazing writer and everyone tells me how great I am as to not hurt my feelings or to avoid an argument, etc.. Then I decide to inquire "Am I really an amazing writer?" and dig into that question a bit, examine my work, etc. Then at some point in the inquiry I realize that I'm an awful writer, and say "I'm not an amazing writer!" the result is truth, realization, that what my thoughts were are different than what reality was.

 

In the same way when we inquire about who we really are we'll continuously discover what we are not and in that there is truth until we've understood everything we are not. Then what is left is what we are.

 

Don't take my word for it.. in fact that's the worst thing you could do. Examine for yourself and see what you find.

 

All the best,

Nate

[Matt]

The Self is God. 'I AM' is God. If God be apart from the Self, He must be a Selfless God, which is absurd. All that is required to realize the Self is to be still. What can be easier than that? Hence atma vidya [self-Knowlegde] is the easiest to attain.

 

- Maharshi's Gospel (p. 25)

Edited April 30, 2010 by Matt

[5ENSES]

If following "Who am I?" has become a mechanical thing, rather than a means for discovery, perhaps it's currently useless for you.

 

I did not take up the "Who am I?" question until I had mastery over basic sitting and counting breath practice. By the time I began "Who am I?", my mind was already pretty quiet through practicing attention to the zazen form, including counting breaths and the physical points of attention (eyes open, thumbs touching, solid seat, etc).

 

If your thoughts are too distracting, going back to basic practice might give you more rapid progress in returning to the question, with more confidence and conviction. Since you are trying to breakthrough a particular thinking level, I would caution against entrenching yourself deeper by developing too many thought patterns on this question. :-)

 

That said, some of the suggestions that have been made in this thread to shift the question to address arising thoughts are, in my experience, very helpful in breaking through this sticky thinking point.

[forestofsouls]

I don't think "Who am I" is conducive to producing special states. I don't think that's the point. Who am I?, in my experience so far, moves beyond the objects. That means beyond thoughts, sensations, states. All these come and go, and nowhere do the great Masters say, "Ask Who am I? and then wait for a particular experience." If it brought about a particular experience, it would have a beginning and an end, and it would not be who you really are every moment.