Can feeling good be bad karma?

[awake]

I went through a course last year called DHE 2000 by Richard Bandler. It was about how to control your state (Feelings) to whatever you want them to be, increase your joy, happiness, etc. After going through the program, I noticed my awareness was increased, I was thinking less, and I had about 5 momentary feelings of bliss in my neck peppered around in the next few days (3 were while listening to another one of his products, 2 were while I was laying on my couch getting ready to listen to a product about presence as applied to women).

 

Anyway, about 6 months later, I had 3 instances within a day of eachother (2 within about 10 minutes of eachother, and 1 that night/next night, cant remember which night) where in that same spot in my neck, I experienced terrible terrible pain, as if someone had shocked me with a taser right there.

 

The program called for you to remember what it was like to have a feeling (ilicit the state/feeling) anchor it (make a switch in your mind that was labelled the feeling), then pump/decrease it (pull the lever up/down). It worked, I was not able to make the feelings very strong, but I did manipulate them. I presume it is possible with practice to get a better control of these things.

 

My question is, is it better to take this path of controlling how good I feel, or to just simply continue practice with no-mind (seeing thoughts float by and controlling my breathing), where I do not really feel much at all?

Edited May 9, 2009 by awake

[Birch]

Oh. Good question!

 

Which one makes more sense to you? Which one makes you feel better? Do you have any examples of when either seemed to be the case? i do;-) Lots and lots of them.

 

You could try both in equal measure. I don't really know you and I feel much too responsible telling you what to do on an online forum. As I keep saying, my golf sucks;-)

 

Could you start easy? Grounding exercises every day, a bit of mindfulness. Maybe some western therapy (you can get good therapy here!) Maybe some acupuncture.

 

Get your intellectual curiosity some real food. Read. Study. Not for exams, for you.

Get your body some real food. Eat. Have fun. Work out. Love.

 

Change the avatar to something that is not shaking;-)

 

Kate

[awake]

Which one makes more sense to you?

 

To me, meditation = wisdom, feeling good = practical experience. The former hasn't caught up with the latter yet, and this program seems like a "shortcut" through the process, but I don't know if I'll miss out on the wisdom (in the form of, attachmentless mindset) by not meditating. Then again, the process of DHE 2000 is like meditation, but with switches in your mind where you pump the feelings while meditating. So I don't know which one makes more sense, I am confused.

 

Which one makes you feel better?

 

I've had some extreme experiences with both, I'd say DHE 2000 made me feel better overall though (since the bliss) but even this I'm not sure of.

 

Do you have any examples of when either seemed to be the case?

 

Yes, yes, and yes twice more. This is why I'm not sure of what to do. If it wasn't for the [possibly resulting] neck pain, I would give DHE a second shot, so I want to see people's opinions here on what controlling your feelings could cause you in the long run versus surrender to nothingness.

[Birch]

I guess meditation makes me feel better in the long run (although it's no shortcut and has actually brought up more things than I care to deal with;-)) but in the short term, a variety of good food, exercise, time outdoors, time with friends, intellectual curiosity...

 

When I feel something's out of whack I'll sometimes go for massage, acupuncture, a walk, see a friend, just stop and breathe...

 

I think a lot depends on your goal. If I wanted to run a marathon then I'd have to train for it. My goal for meditation is just to improve life, develop awareness and get some skills to handle what comes up better. Because things do come up;-)

[Owledge]

Change the avatar to something that is not shaking;-)

Actually it's zooming.

But its size is 1,2 MB. It made my network cable glow red-hot.

 

I just got a crazy idea: Cram it all in one picture! Take all 100 frames of the animation and put each in a separate layer with 1% opacity each. Then see what the result is.

 

If you don't know how do do that, maybe I'll be in the mood for that later. ... Maybe not.

[awake]

Actually it's zooming.

But its size is 1,2 MB. It made my network cable glow red-hot.

 

I just got a crazy idea: Cram it all in one picture! Take all 100 frames of the animation and put each in a separate layer with 1% opacity each. Then see what the result is.

 

If you don't know how do do that, maybe I'll be in the mood for that later. ... Maybe not.

 

My old avatar was bart simpson tripping on slurpee, that switched between like 4 frames. This one is a mandelbrot set.(fractal)

 

Still cool to watch Looking for advice on this issue still.

Edited May 11, 2009 by awake

[ralis]

My old avatar was bart simpson tripping on slurpee, that switched between like 4 frames. This one is a mandelbrot set.(fractal)

 

Still cool to watch Looking for advice on this issue still.

 

First of all, karma is just another control mechanism used by the machine i.e, any belief system. If you feel guilty or have any so called neg. feeling, then your life is not your own, it belongs to the machine.

 

Does karma exist?

 

 

ralis

[gendao]

I just got a crazy idea: Cram it all in one picture! Take all 100 frames of the animation and put each in a separate layer with 1% opacity each. Then see what the result is.

Or take 2 animation series and alternate their frames one after another - to effectively splice 2 movies together - and see which one you see when you play it back?

[Yoda]

Awake,

 

 

I'm a believer in the "if it feels good then it is good" school of thought but it pays to be *really* picky about what actually feels good... like with the alcoholic who drinks to feel good... something is wrong with the situation. The taser thing sounds like a warning sign that something is off.

 

I think bliss and emptiness are mutually supportive and you don't have to choose between the two.

 

One thing meditation has going for it is that it is easier to just empty the mind than it is to change it. With emptying the mind, good feelings naturally come in.

 

Your pal,

Yoda

[Pero]

Replying to Can feeling good be bad karma?

 

Depends on why you are feeling good. If you feel good because you just slaughtered your neighbours dog because he wouldn't stop barking at night and always kept you awake, then it would be "bad karma".

 

But for what you describe, I'd say no.

[Trixter Streetcat]

I'd like to ask the opposite question:

 

can feeling bad be good karma? couldn't it be a sort of cleansing, karma unloading process?

 

i sure hope it is...

[trailmaker]

I'd like to ask the opposite question:

 

can feeling bad be good karma? couldn't it be a sort of cleansing, karma unloading process?

 

i sure hope it is...

 

 

i got to figure it as cleansing - enough remorse - no blame. enough negativity, for every low there's a high.

[goldisheavy]

My question is, is it better to take this path of controlling how good I feel, or to just simply continue practice with no-mind (seeing thoughts float by and controlling my breathing), where I do not really feel much at all?

 

This is my opinion. The only time you should control your feelings is in an emergency. Controlling (a.k.a. micromanaging) the feelings is NOT a long term solution, and should not be practiced for the long term benefit.

 

What you erroneously call "no-mind" is a better approach for the long term.

 

Understand the implications of controlling. When you control something you are saying that this thing you're manipulating is inherently unreliable, not yet of benefit to you, that its natural state is one of detriment to you, that its natural state is one of unruliness and therefore it should be controlled to bring it in line with your expectations, etc. Understand these implications well and be careful. Do you want to foster such implications?

 

I would say that to eliminate control altogether is also very bad, that's another extreme, which is equally as bad as trying to control everything.

 

When controlling is done with few expectations, playfully, for the purpose of enjoyment and not for the purpose of survival, in other words, when it's non-essential, it's OK. Or, if something is very important, and you control it for a short time due to an emergency, that's also OK. But becoming obsessed with controlling one's experience so that you do it day to day (not an emergency) and at the same time you take it very seriously (make it a formal path), that's asking for trouble.

Edited May 11, 2009 by goldisheavy

[awake]

I'd like to ask the opposite question:

 

can feeling bad be good karma? couldn't it be a sort of cleansing, karma unloading process?

 

i sure hope it is...

 

 

Thank you all for your suggestions so far. I too am wondering about this question this poster is asking, as I have been having negative feelings come up for me, and notice my ability to call them up at will. They also come up as a result of thoughts, and I am able to stop thought and stay with the feeling. I wonder if doing so is "cleansing" them from my self, or deepening them.

Edited May 12, 2009 by awake

[Pero]

I'd like to ask the opposite question:

 

can feeling bad be good karma? couldn't it be a sort of cleansing, karma unloading process?

 

i sure hope it is...

 

Feeling bad can be negative past karma coming into fruition, so yes. In the same way, feeling good can be positive past karma coming into fruition.

[Ian]

Don't worry - bad karma is good karma !